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seajohn
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Dr Love and Skip are correct in the issue of politeness and emphasis of the ror reua (r) letter.
Of course the word in question will always be spelled with a ror reua (except when people are writing slang, such as we do when writing "I wanna..." for instance).
When I mentioned that we should not say "crap" I was not referring to the r but to the pronunciation of the vowel, as I have seen and heard some confusion about that.
The vowel is like u in cup when the word is spoken in its shortest form.
It can be extended to like o in top (like or orng)
Or even to aah (like the doctor tells you to open your mouth and say aaah) in some cases (like selah ah).
The pronunciation changes depending on situations of politeness and appropriacy mentioned by Skip and Dr Love. Basically the longer it is the sweeter (or more patronizing) it is, and the shorter the more formal. But there many be exceptions to this.
Yurune, I said "as long as you're not saying 'crap'" because I wanted to emphasize that the vowel in never pronounced like the "a" in "crap", though I have often heard native English speakers confusing that sound of a with the correct ones for this word which I listed above. As I mentioned in an earlier post, English alphabet has many sounds for "a" which are fairly interchangeable. But in Thai that would result in different words altogether because those sounds are different letters and not related.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 8:27 pm on May 25, 2006
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Yurune
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Then I refer to the last line of my post....
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 10:58 pm on May 25, 2006
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seajohn
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Very gracious of you! 555 Just shows again how this does indeed get so tricky for us when trying to write about foreign alphabets or phonetics with transliterations using English alphabet. But we perservere.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 11:25 pm on May 25, 2006
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Yurune
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Yep...transliteration is a pain, I've always learned by what are considered the correct guidlines eg 'h' after initial consonenant makes it a hard sound (Pooket as opposed to Fooket) kor gai is always a 'k', just gotta learn it to be the case.
Different ear to sounds as well...even betweeen native English speakers, but hell it makes it fun, it'd be interesting to all meet up and ban English for the evening.... :Laugh:
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 11:48 pm on May 25, 2006
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seajohn
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Yes, and I feel that unfortunately the linguists (who must've been an alien race born with their egg-shaped heads up their asses) who designed the present more or less official transliteration system used for roadsigns and official documents bearing people's names in English, have made it more difficult.
I don't mind such attempts as "Ph"uket or "Th"ai or "Kh"un because as I mentioned earlier these are attempts to show that this time the "P" or "T" is aspirated (a small gust of air comes out of your mouth when you say it), whereas there are other P's, T's, and K's in the alphabet that are not aspirated. However not many people understand that and I often think people are putting H's after these consonants indescriminately (I have to go back and check the Thai spelling to know how it should be).
But what gets me is substituting one letter for another just because it is phonetically similiar. Cases in point: Chatuchak market should be Jatujak. Certainly if you're a linguist you know that j is related to ch, but come on! You're going to have much more success in Thailand with j for jor jahn than ch. There are already some ch letters anyway in Thai. Those linguist dicks!
Or this stupid insistance of putting k for g. Jesus, had they ever come down and spoken with real Thais to find out what sound gor gai makes? Or did they design this one in another country? Or was it done by a Thai? Again, yes linguistically g is part of the k family because of how the sound is made... But people should use g when it's g goddamnit!
Another one: Thai has only 6 possible consonant sounds in which to end a word. Even in their alphabet if a word happens to end in another letter, it is regularly converted to one of the 6. But noooo, when Thai's write they have to write the original transliterated letter, letter after letter after letter, which doesn't tell us anything about how to pronounce it... unless you know how to read Thai as well. But that's how they've learned to do it in school.
Just try looking at Thai first or last names. What a hodge-podge of spelling nonsense. No one who didn't know Thai would know how to pronounce these, would they? A few examples: Kamolwan, Chantikarn, Siripongspanich, Virat... and so on.
Virat... What the hell's wrong with W... It's so much closer to W... There isn't even a V in Thai at all!!! I am about to blow my top.
Maybe other people are more intuitive than me, but I would like to demand linguistic reform. Maybe I should write to "ThaiRat" newspaper...
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:03 am on May 26, 2006
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Skip
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Yurune- we ARE for all intents and purposes talking about 2 different words here. That is, unless you are a 'lumper' and see no distinction between saying- 'Thx', 'Thanks', 'Thank you', and 'Thank you very much' in everyday conversation.
But then, if you are the sort that sees the above as distinct forms of polite speech you will appreciate that Khap and Khrap are distinct as well- because they are just that.
You know as well as I do that in the field of linguistics there is no definitive or globally accepted scheme to transliterate the English to Thai. And that only adds to the confusion of nuance. But khap and khrap are different words and used as such in the everyday language of native speakers here.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:58 am on May 26, 2006
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phantomtony
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1) For measurement and distance, is the word "meters" "kilometer" etc. also used in Thai. If not, then how to pronounce the word meter and kilometer.
2) If I need or want something, what is the best way to ask for it. ex: beer
thanks
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 7:15 am on June 10, 2006
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seajohn
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Wow, my time has been so consumed lately in the interesting anthropological questions posed on another thread that I forgot to respond to you, Tyfon. Forgive me.
In regards to your site, that's an interesting idea indicating the tones. Once someone practices it, it should be easy. As for the transliteration you asked about, well it seems consistent enough I guess... and fairly accurate for the way I as an American from a certain region would read and pronounce... but it's hard to say--I read the Thai and already know. We'd have to listen to others who couldn't read and compare their reactions.
But as I may have mentioned, I don't think that for begineers the tones should be paid as much attention to as the new vowels.
phantomtony... The metric system is used here and meter/s is pronounced "meet" (no plural indicator necessary) and kilometer/s is "kilomeet" or sometimes just "kilo" which is exactly what they also say for kilograms. So we refer to the context of course.
About asking for things, it depends on the circumstances and who you're speaking to.
In a bar to a bargirl say "Ow beer (Singh, etc), khrap." (I'm assuming you are a man).
The same in most restaurants, "Oa (like ow)..., khrap."
If you need to ask for something in a more polite manner or something more unusual, like an extra blanket at your hotel, you can say, "kor (like caw)... noi, khrap."
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:59 am on June 10, 2006
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