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fastmover
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Mr . Arramsey...I am not trying prove "my case' since I am not a lawyer and certainly do not have a client
I am only posing a situation to indicate that maybe this problem has a lot more ramifications than we can actually really answer.
Let's chill, you know there is no correct answer, because we can be 'situationed' to death....for example, you said.....
"You are scanning the letter ONLY to find out who it belongs to with the good intention of returning it to that person - and this can be found out by reading ONLY the address ( if any ) , the salutation and/or the sign-off .
-I can see no reason to peruse any other part of the letter".........
But what if the only evidence for ownership of the letter was in the body of the letter, not clearly at the end or begining.
I was just generalising a situation that must be fairly common in a public place.
And speaking of that.........
Mr Expatchuck, I have to agree with you entirely, but only if the person leaving the letter or computer has LEFT the area, without the intention of returning shortly, like if he only went to the W.C. or was using the phone.
Public does not equal privacy. Never has, never will.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:49 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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Arramsey
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Quote: from fastmover on 5:49 pm on Oct. 12, 2003
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But what if the only evidence for ownership of the letter was in the body of the letter, not clearly at the end or begining. Ý
Fastmover ,
Even if the evidence of ownership is only in the body of the letter ( although I find this a specious argument ) still you have scanned the letter ONLY with the good intention of returning it to the person who wrote it or the person who was to recieve it . You did not scan the letter with the intention of using the contents for other purposes .
There lies the difference .
Quote from Fastmover :_
Public does not equal privacy. Never has, never will.
Fastmover ,
I know that you are currently in China - but I am not aware of your country of origin . But if you are from one of the so called developed nations then I am sure that you are aware that you are entitled to your privacy in even in public places .
For instance if you at a table in a Restaurant with your wife and/or children no one will be justified in encroaching on your privacy unless they have your permission - and this will be upheld by the law of that nation .
So from whence do you get this proclamation that "Public does not equal privacy - never has , never will" ??
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 6:03 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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fastmover
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Well basically the conduct of people in public is both legally and socially formalized.
Looking at someone's computer screen in public would not be a crime under the law, but would be socially unacceptible.
The point is that once we enter public space the rules of privacy change depending on the situation. Movie stars suffer that reality every time they enter the public light.
The letter situation is of course complicated by the intent of the person reading it.
That intent is almost impossible to prove, so would become mute in any discussion of privacy.
By the way, let me be frank with you. I do not believe for an instant that you would not intrude into someone's private messages if you saw a name of someone from your family mentioned in a rather strange email account.
Although I am not conversant in the law, I would think that a man is entitled to inspect whatever would cause his family harm, email or otherwise, PROVIDING he did not break the law in order to gain the information.
Looking at an open email account with a families name involved , on a computer that has been left, does not constitute any crime.
But ignoring the email at the possible peril of harm to a family member, would be a crime, against your own family.
There is no way that you or anyone else could convince me that you, or whoever , would let that happen.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 6:23 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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Arramsey
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Quote: from fastmover on 6:23 pm on Oct. 12, 2003
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By the way, let me be frank with you. ÝI do not believe for an instant that you would not intrude into someone's private messages if you saw a name of someone from your family mentioned in a rather strange email account.------------------------------------------------------
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Fastmover ,
Whether you believe me or not is neither here nor there - BUT I reiterate that I would never read anyone else's E-Mail or letter even if I inadvertantly saw my friend's or my brother's name in there .
How would I know that there was something damaging to my friend or my brother , because I would not read the contents ?
I am getting tired of this argument for arguments sake .
First you ask me 2 questions . When I answer you say you do not believe me .
If you are not going to believe me - why do you ask me questions in the first place ?
Or is it - that I should only give the answer you are looking for & then you will believe me ?
Anyway what needs to be said on this subject has been said more eloquently by Arcadius , Dr. Love & others.
Just read through all the posts and do some thinking - I have no more to say on this Thread .
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 6:37 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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Arcadius
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Lest we forget, amid these ever wider ramifications, Roland was not dealing with a terrorist plot or any kind of threat to his family.
He read the girl's e-mails purely out of idle curiosity, and then gratuitously meddled with her private life out of some self-righteous desire to punish her for wrongdoing and/or save people he doesn't know from Adam from themselves.
It's called sticking your nose into other people's business. And where I come from it's heartily despised.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:47 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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China Sailor
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Arramsey,
I do not know what country you are from but I am an American. ÝSo using precedent, which is the basis of Western Law:
1. ÝNot logging out of your eMail is stupid (esp. if you are scamming several people).
2. ÝOne of the US's greatest Supreme Court jurists, Olliver Wendell Jones Jr. once observed during an opinion (And I believe that he was quoting Mark Twain), "Stupidity is a capital offense and it carries its own unique form of punnishment".
Therefore: ÝThis BG has commited the capital offense of stupidity and her punnishment is having a punter discover her scam and blow the whistle.
That being said, my approach would have been to log her email off, and spread the word in every possible forum, shithouse, and barroom conversation I could...
Nuff said!
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 7:04 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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expatchuck
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Arramsey:
I fully understand the need for privacy. Ý
At some point in time, however, people need to take responsibility for their own actions. ÝOne of the problems in any hypothetical situation such as these is you can always excuse your actions by saying you "intended" to log off or you "meant" to mail the letter.
The fact remains that you didn't, Ýand you have no right to feel offended because somebody took advantage of your own stupidity and carelessness.
When people screw up, they should expect to face the consequences.
ps: ÝI am not using "you" above meaning you. ÝOK?
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 7:29 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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expatchuck
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Arcadius:
I further agree that sticking your nose where it does not belong tends to get it bloodied.
That being said, however, what IF Roland did discover a terrorist plot? ÝShould he then continue, or should he cease and desist immediately in order not to intrude?
In other words...do you think there is EVER a time when snooping could be justified?
By the way, I have the morals of an alley cat but I would not have meddled in her private affairs. ÝI might have read her e-mails and had a good laugh but that would have been the end of it.
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 7:38 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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Arcadius
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Fine. Absent-mindedness, carelessness, lack of intelligence and simple common-or-garden mistakes all deserve to be punished. If we can't seize on anything else to justify our own quite deliberate baseness, let's tell ourselves we're striking a blow for supreme jurist Wendell Jones Jr.
I suggest we target old people especially, as they are vaguer than most. Survival of the fittest and all.
f_ck, is this really so hard? If you notice someone leaving a restaurant without their bag, mobile or camera, you chase after them, don't you? If not, please just go away and hang yourself and do the rest of the world a favour.
expat
Well, I certainly wouldn't snoop into other people's private correspondence on the pretty far-fetched grounds that it might contain a terrorist plot. Otherwise - on both snooping per se (as opposed to interfering) & terrorism - I think I tackled same a page or so back.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:24 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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vox
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Quote: from ROLAND on 12:49 am on Oct. 11, 2003
Walking down Soi4 last Wednesday night at 2am I had the urge to check my emails so I popped in the internet cafe opposite the Hilary Bar. I logged on and then realised something was wrong, somebody had used their hotmail and not logged out. Of course being naturally nosey I had to look and to be honest I was quite stunned.
It was a girl who worked opposite in the Hillary bar and she wasn't just emailing 1 or 2 guys with sob stories for cash their were literally dozens of guys in contact all thinking their tilac was only thinking of them and a lot of guys were sending her money too. Not only this she had opened an account on 'facepic' no doubt looking for more suckers.
Some of the emails were quite heartbreaking as I knew they were being had over by this bitch...
Sorry, I don't think in my humble opinion that this girl is in any way a "bitch." Ý She's WORKING, you know? ÝAnd the soliciting-money-from-many-guys thing is considered to be part of working, pure and simple. ÝPlease, let's not forget that that's all that ALL Thai BGs are doing, working. ÝSure, some do genuinely find love with a farang, but remember that for the vast majority, it's just a job, and one they only feel (correctly) that they have a limited number of years to do...so they're going to get whatever they can while they can, and soliciting money long distance is one way to do that.
I get to see this from the inside because my girlfriend is a working BG. ÝThere's no way I could compensate her on a par with what she makes, and I really don't want to try...she's driven and determined and confident and this is just what she does for work. ÝI accept it, and so other guys support her and she spends every free moment with me. ÝShe's not interested in my money, haha, I know this because I have very little and she knows this too. ÝOh, I should also point out that I speak pretty good Lao (her native language) and decent Thai, and also read it and write it...so I get to know the real person she is, not some parody filtered through that awful bar-girl English.
Anyway, one of the ways she makes money is, she asks for money from guys she's gone with here who are now back in their countries. ÝAnd Ýjust like in this post, there are a bunch of them. ÝHer letters are particularly clear, too, haha, because I write them for her, as well as translate all those text messages she's always getting on her cellphone, as she doesn't read a word of English.
I'm there every time she gets a call from some poor guy who forget that THIS IS JUST WORK for her, and she's sitting on my lap in our 2,000 baht a month apartment smiling at me while she tells him all the standard I miss you my darlings, I love you only one, I wait you come back, etc. ÝOh yeah, and I also coach her on how to fake orgasms Ýand in general be exactly the fantasy sex machine (haha, yeah right) that farang men are expecting so she can get done with them faster, pocket more cash, and get home to me.
Granted, our case is unusual since I'm a farang, but believe me, there are plenty of BGs who have Thai boyfriends--and husbands--whose laps they are sitting on when they smooch into the phone to their CUSTOMERS and tell them of their monogamous love for them. Ý
Being a BG is a business; it's a profession. ÝThe money soliciting thing (not to mention all those very convincing faked orgasms) is just part of it. ÝDeal with it.
vox
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:26 am on Oct. 12, 2003
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