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BoomARang
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Arcadius - I'm with you pretty much down the line although I already know the answer as to whether or not I would look if given the chance. ÝI wouldn't.
Not for any case of consience or anything, mainly because I don't have one, but more so, I don't really see it as doing me any good.
My girlfriend gave me her password one time and I know she meant it sincerely wanting to let me know she was a good girl but I've never looked and forgot what her password was about 10 minutes after she told me.
On the other hand, what's to stop one from having multiple addresses, one for each BF? Ý
Even if I found out a girl I had feelings for was communicating with multiple guys, it would be no different than the whole dating game anywhere else in the world where the name of the game is competition.
How many Western women have more than one on a stringer? ÝAnyone who thinks that an attractive woman from the West would never have more than one boyfriend at at time might be surprised.
In Japan, the yonger girls are famous for having one boyfriend who has a car, one boyfriend for going out dancing, one boyfriend for going to movies, one boyfriend for f_cking their brains out,,,,
,,, All of 'em, you pay on the way in or you pay on the way out and they are the ones that get to play! Ý;)
"Treat queens like whores and whores like queens and you'll never spend a lonely night." Ý
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:12 am on Feb. 5, 2003
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Chompoo
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In my opinion she is just exercising her financial and negotiation skills to get what she feels is due. It's not like she is stealing from anyone.
I think she has a right to try to get as much as she can, just like it seems many members want to try and get it for a little as they can or even for free.
I've gone over this before. It is stealing! She is using fraud and deceit to get cash from these guys. Telling outright lies and making promises she can't keep. In every business this is unethical, even if it were about love it is unethical.
What gives her this right to use whatever means necessary to get the money? If you are condoning her behavior then you must also not condemn me if I, say, take a girl with me to Pattaya for two weeks, tell her I love her and that I want to pay for her to get out of the game. Then I come back to America and give her absolutely nothing. That, apparently to you is fair and you should not judge me?
I find it offensive that you would lump those who ethically try to get lower prices, like BigDUSA, in with those who will lie, cheat and steal to get what they want.
Nothing gives the girls the right to cheat and yes steal from their customers. You can understand why they do it and even feel sympathy or pity that they are in a bad situation, but that doesn't give them the right to cheat and steal. To give them that right is demeaning to everyone who tries to live ethically.
And .. I'm sure many of those members pretend to love the female and say you are the only one and then run to an MP for a quickie or whatever. This is the game that both sides play and play to win.
So .. she said he was the only one and there was no one else. It's all part of the game. They lie. We lie.
There are limits and not all lies are equal. Saying she doesn't have a boyfriend and that she really loves me is fine for that two week island vacation. Saying that she is not seeing other customers and asking for or even just accepting money in exchange for that is not okay.
It is amusing, entertaining, even flattering when BGs tell me that we would make beautiful luk kreung babies together or that they would make good wives (or mistresses). However, if that flirting went so far that either of us took it seriously or that one party tried to use it for leverage, then that again is crossing the line.
Does this make it right?? NO. But ... that's how it generally works with the tg's and the clients.
We all accept that some, maybe many, BGs lie and cheat and that many customers do the same. We don't have to condone or pretend that it's okay or even justifiable.
I will say that if she has actually taken ccvvbb money or things then that in my opinion would be crossed the line.
She has already scammed others and is clearly setting ccvvbb up for the same scam. That is evidence enough.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 2:31 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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Chompoo
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Chompoo - did you write the job-description for all prostitutes ? You think that scamming customers is not part of their job - but do all of them think so ? And do they not have the right to decide what their job entails ? Or maybe you can draw up a document stating clearly what a prostitute can or cannot do and any interested brothers can get this agreed to and signed by the prostitutes before any involvement .
This is ridiculous. You're saying that a prostitute is justified in cheating and stealing because they believe it is part of their job? Do we all get to define the limits of ethics so loosely? Do you work for Enron, by any chance?
You do not have to get a signed contract for every transaction and every human interaction. That is a preposterous suggestion. If everyone is free to act completely without morals or ethics then society breaks down into anarchy. Do you grant me the right to act completely without ethics? Maybe only when dealing with hookers?
Oh really ? And isn't it an accepted moral and ethical standard WORLD-WIDE that you do not pry into anothers private correspondence without permission ? Yet , I don't see anyone on this Forum even one bit concerned at this totally depraved action .
Yes, REALLY. Perhaps you should ask my opinion on looking into other people's email accounts before you rush to judgement and try to point out hypocrisy where it doesn't exist. It is not my job to point out every ethical and moral transgression. When I see people whose thoughts are so clearly wrong and they try to further that awful opinion (as you have done) I do usually point it out, but I can't be expected to do everything.
Further, you must realize that there are degrees of ethical violations. Simply looking into someone's email account is not on the same scale as scamming them for large amounts of money and potentially causing them great emotional distress.
Is it really that foreign a concept to you guys that you should treat others as you would have them treat you? And that you would expect (and hope) that others feel the same way? I really can't see how you guys can possibly justify this hypocrisy.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:44 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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ABC
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Chompoo:
So ... by taking your statement at face value, then you will also say that any member that lies or deceives the Ýfemale is also wrong and is stealing in a way.
What is the difference between the guy that says I like you and want to see you and only you so he can either get sex for free or cheaper price and then also goes out and has sex with other females??
"Telling outright lies and making promises she can't keep. In every business this is unethical, even if it were about love it is unethical." -
So ... I assume you will hold the other members of this forum accountable to that statement?? Because you can not be saying that it's cool for us to lie and deceive to get what we want to not okay for the females to do it.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 3:33 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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Chompoo
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So ... by taking your statement at face value, then you will also say that any member that lies or deceives the Ýfemale is also wrong and is stealing in a way.
What is the difference between the guy that says I like you and want to see you and only you so he can either get sex for free or cheaper price and then also goes out and has sex with other females??
Yes, telling lies is almost always unethical. It's surprising that I really have to say that. But, there is a big difference between various lies. It's also surprising I have to say that.
I admit that I lie to the girls. When they ask, I sometimes tell them I'm at a different hotel (usually I just try to avoid the question without lying). When pressed I tell them I will try to come back to their bar, even if I don't really plan to. These are relatively harmless lies and are partly to save face and partly to avoid unpleasantness.
I also tell the girls (sometimes) that they are the most beautiful girl in the bar, or that they have the prettiest smile I've ever seen. Those are also relatively harmless and both parties should know it is harmless flattery.
However, I do not try to get them to believe that we have a future in order to get better service or cheaper prices. I don't tell them I lost my ATM card, and will pay them next time. I wouldn't tell them I've been fixed and I can't have babies just so they will go without a condom. And I certainly wouldn't keep several girls on the hook, misleading them into thinking I'm going to "rescue" them while they passed up real opportunities with other men.
So ... I assume you will hold the other members of this forum accountable to that statement?? Because you can not be saying that it's cool for us to lie and deceive to get what we want to not okay for the females to do it.
I'm not at all saying it's cool for you or me to deceive the girls with the sole intent of getting "what we want". Some lies are relatively harmless and may even be well-intentioned. Others are only blatant self-interest at the expense of others.
Can you please answer the question as to how you can resolve this hypocrisy? That it is okay for the girls to cheat and lie, but not okay for me to, say not pay a freelancer because she did not establish a price up front?
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:53 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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ABC
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Chompoo:
So which lies are okay?? The ones that married men tell to their wives??
And you might think that your lies are harmless, but how do you know??
And what is the difference between a female saying you are the only one for me and you telling her she's the most beautiful girl. Both can be interpreted as harmless flattery. We all know that these are just words they throw around. Just like you are a handsome man. Pleaze?? We can't all be that good looking. ha ha ha!!
"That it is okay for the girls to cheat and lie, but not okay for me to, say not pay a freelancer because she did not establish a price up front?"
I don't have a problem with you not paying an established price upfront. If you did not negotaite the price before the deed, then you can negotiate afterwards.
And ... I'm not saying that it's cool for them to lie, but I can understand why they do and would not hold it against them if they do.
Okay. Unless I am going to sponsor them. Then I would expect them not to lie. But ... maybe my expectations are too high??
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:11 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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Chompoo
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So which lies are okay?? The ones that married men tell to their wives??
There are some cases where a husband lying to or misleading his wife is understandable. I've seen cases here and on other boards where it seemed like the guy was doing the best thing for his marriage and his wife by not being completely forthcoming (e.g. BigDUSA, I believe). There are other cases where the husband is being completely unfair and seriously endangering his wife (e.g. when the guy is spending the college fund on hookers or having a romantic affair and planning on ditching the wife, etc.).
And what is the difference between a female saying you are the only one for me and you telling her she's the most beautiful girl. Both can be interpreted as harmless flattery. We all know that these are just words they throw around. Just like you are a handsome man. Pleaze?? We can't all be that good looking. ha ha ha!!
And you might think that your lies are harmless, but how do you know??
It is sometimes a judgement call as to which lies are harmful and which aren't. How can you be so dense as to not see that? Do you really not see a difference between a guy flattering a girl in a bar and a woman extorting money from a customer with blatant lies?
Tell me what convoluted scenario you envision where my deception about my hotel is seriously harmful. Compare that to the many real stories of guys who have wrecked their families and lost their retirement money to a girl who lied to him solely with the intent of taking his money.
Seriously, can you think for one second about what you are saying before writing it down. You have absolutely no basis for anything you are saying and are just wasting our time.
I don't have a problem with you not paying an established price upfront. If you did not negotaite the price before the deed, then you can negotiate afterwards.
No, you are yet again missing the point. I'm not negotiating at all; I'm just not paying them period. This is a girl I picked up in Thermae and she never mentioned money. Why should I pay her a single baht? In fact, even if we did agree on a price beforehand why can't I just change my mind and decide I don't feel like paying?
And ... I'm not saying that it's cool for them to lie, but I can understand why they do and would not hold it against them if they do.
What you said was that they have "a right to get as much as she can" and that "she is exercising her financial and negotiation skills to get what she feels is due," and many other similar statements.
I have never said anything but that I understand why they do it. And I have never said that I would beat a girl senseless for trying to rip me off. But you go a lot further in that by your words you are condoning and justifying their behavior.
The first step in fighting corruption and ethical misconduct is to admit that it is wrong. It may be expedient for you to pay off a cop for a speeding ticket and the system may make it hard to do the right thing, but an ethical person will at least admit that the system is f_cked and regret the way things are (and hopefully do whatever small part they can to improve things).
Okay. Unless I am going to sponsor them. Then I would expect them not to lie. But ... maybe my expectations are too high??
This is again an example of your hypocrisy. It's okay for them to do it to others, but wrong when you are lied to?
You really have no problem with people who you know will lie and cheat you to "get what they feel they're due"? You feel there should be no retribution or consequences for complete fraud and deceit?
Everyone is entitled to their own philosophy of life, but some like yours lead to ridiculous conclusions and force you to act like a hypocrite.
If you cannot admit that what this girl is doing is wrong, then you have no ethical basis to condemn any board member for underpaying the girls, getting a girl pregnant and leaving her, divulging all her personal info on the net, ...; all things which you have criticized in the past.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:58 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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jjsushi
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Quote: from Chompoo on 3:31 am on Feb. 6, 2003
In my opinion she is just exercising her financial and negotiation skills to get what she feels is due. It's not like she is stealing from anyone.
I think she has a right to try to get as much as she can, just like it seems many members want to try and get it for a little as they can or even for free.
I've gone over this before. It is stealing! She is using fraud and deceit to get cash from these guys. Telling outright lies and making promises she can't keep. In every business this is unethical, even if it were about love it is unethical.
I think you are a bit confused here. Stealing is not lying, it is not fraud and it is not deceit. ÝThe terms are not synonymous. They each have very specific meanings. The young lady would be stealing if she took property without permission. She is given money willingly by benefactors by using deceit but she is no way stealing. Ý
You get pretty hung up on this holding prostitutes to a moral and ethical standard.
The reality, as I mentioned before, is that prostitution is usually an illegal business; considered a disreputable and immoral business by mainstream societies;usually operates in a world controlled by organized crime.
The prostitutes are merely products of their illegal world and their behaviors and practices are reflections of that world. There are of course exceptions to the rule but that is not the norm. ÝFear, greed, violence, death, lies, deceit, fraud, scams, etc are dominant in the underworld. There is no legal system or lawyers; there is no court where these people can settle their differences; there is not pension plan and health benefits; there is no regulatory body;there is no civil methods of recourse. There is only street justice and the basest form of survival of the fittest. Your mainstream ideals of ethics and morals don't work well in that world and you would be a fool to think that you can apply them there.
When Disney operates a legal prostitution business then maybe you can champion your cause for morally and ethically upstanding prostitutes, until then it is a pure pipe dream.
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:46 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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ABC
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Chompoo:
"There are some cases where a husband lying to or misleading his wife is understandable. "
And that is why you will never have an honest relationship with a female. Just shows your lack of morales and/or your lack of understanding what marriage is all about.
I'm not going to judge or preach to the ones that lie to their wifes, because each person is responsible for their own actions. If they chose to do so, then it's their choice. But .... I'm also not going to say that it's understandable either.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:16 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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haam sup
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This is hilarious!
Look, there are at least a dozen ways to say it, but you have to fall back on the saying made famous by Trink: T.I.T.
Your typical American (or European, or ?) sense of ethics are not operative in Thailand. ÝAnd what ethics exist in greater Thai society don't apply to the bargirl/nightlife/prostitution scene, either.
It's THEIR card game, and your best hope is to sit out a LOT of hands, until you get a glimmer of the rules. ÝCrying foul because she suddenly informs you that 3's of spades are wild cards doesn't fly. ÝYou should have known that before you played your hand.
The quickest way to move from a forum pariah, to a pariah in Thailand, is to attempt to hold Thais to your own set of 'ethics'. ÝThe assertion that all lies are unethical only applies to your OWN ethical code. ÝSaving face in Thai society comprises thousands of lies daily, but in the local context, it makes things work.
Now, you could argue that it shouldn't work that way, but shouldda, wouldda, and coulda have nothing to do with anything. ÝThere seems to be no shortage of players willing to play on the BG's home turf. ÝIt just behooves you to know as much about the rules as possible.
There is nothing that says you have to breach your own ethics while playing the game, either. ÝYou can always say "No!". ÝJust being aware that the game is rigged, and that you only have a narrow (self-limited) set of choices by which you can play successfully, increases your odds of coming out intact.
In general, I think that the world would be a better place if everybody behaved according to their own internal set of ethics, as opposed to changing their standards based on their perception of what others do to them. ÝThe idea that it's OK to lie because you were lied to, and to cheat because you were cheated on is the antithesis to integrity.
There are some 'personality boundary' issues evident here, and those kinds of things predispose you to bitterness and disillusionment in the Land of Smiles...
haam sup
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 6:32 pm on Feb. 5, 2003
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