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Adventure Guy
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Koolmanx,
There is not enough time in the day to counter all your invalid and specious arguments, riddled throughout, one-b-one. Since you are not at all interested in learning a little something from others who obviously know of things of which you have far too little or no concept, and insofar as you insist on sticking blindly to your myopic misinformation this will be my last on the subject.
Just one example of far too many: If you opened your eyes/ears just a little to learn you could learn much from Mr. Alan, and you would know as he does that the concept and practice of democracy DOES NOT require political parties to choose their candidates by a democaratic process no matter what you in your ignorance may want to conjecture. (Otherwise how would an independant candidate form a party? Oh, you didn't think about that did you? Along with so much other diatribe.)
It is sad that you are so completely ignorant that you can't even see your own ignorance, and so stubborn as to not want to better yourself intellectually by opening your closed mind to some learning.
As my daddy once told me to never argue with fools I don't have more time to waste in a philosophical argument with someone who doesn't first - have or care - about facts or terminology critical to the argument.
Flame away now to satisfy your obviously fragile ego that can't accept positive criticism.
(Mr. Alan - he's hopeless.)
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:46 am on May 4, 2010
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koolbreez
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 11:22 pm on May 4, 2010
The value is not the point. At that time period 4 beaver pelts were worth the same amount. Taking into consideration inflation as you try to do in establishing todays value. They are worthless, only because they would not physically last this long to have inflation as a factor in considering real world dollar value. Bread, and flour, aren't even close to your dollar figures. Even an axe, or a knife doesn't come close to those today values....lol. They would be worth the same $24 today as they were then. Roughly 4 beaver pelts.
They were simply baubles at the time, and still would be baubles in this time period. The point I was making, and you either can't comprehend, or refuse to, is that Thaksin offered the poor shiny baubles to buy their support, and votes. What he gave them was basically worthless to them because he never created the infrastructure for them to use the baubles. In no way is that free, Democratic politics. He ripped off the poor the same way the Dutch ripped off the Indians, and the poor keep selling their vote the same way the Indians kept selling the same piece of land. Comprende
Without banning all the executives of the party, and thus disbanding the party there will always be a scapegoat to take the fall, and leaders like Thaksin will be allowed to continue to operate. Corruption isn't stopped from the bottom up, it's stopped from the top down. If it means disbanding a political party to stop that parties corrupt ways, so be it.
That's one of the biggest problems with politics in the USA. There is always a scapegoat to take the fall, protecting the real culpret, and the corruption continues.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 2:42 pm on May 4, 2010
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from koolbreez on 2:42 pm on May 4, 2010
The value is not the point. At that time period 4 beaver pelts were worth the same amount. Taking into consideration inflation as you try to do in establishing todays value. They are worthless, only because they would not physically last this long to have inflation as a factor in considering real world dollar value. Bread, and flour, aren't even close to your dollar figures. Even an axe, or a knife doesn't come close to those today values....lol. They would be worth the same $24 today as they were then. Roughly 4 beaver pelts.
They were simply baubles at the time, and still would be baubles in this time period. The point I was making, and you either can't comprehend, or refuse to, is that Thaksin offered the poor shiny baubles to buy their support, and votes. What he gave them was basically worthless to them because he never created the infrastructure for them to use the baubles. In no way is that free, Democratic politics. He ripped off the poor the same way the Dutch ripped off the Indians, and the poor keep selling their vote the same way the Indians kept selling the same piece of land. Comprende
Without banning all the executives of the party, and thus disbanding the party there will always be a scapegoat to take the fall, and leaders like Thaksin will be allowed to continue to operate. Corruption isn't stopped from the bottom up, it's stopped from the top down. If it means disbanding a political party to stop that parties corrupt ways, so be it.
That's one of the biggest problems with politics in the USA. There is always a scapegoat to take the fall, protecting the real culprit, and the corruption continues.
Here is the real point. You originally tried to make a case that the Dutch ripped off the poor Indians by trading Manhattan for beads worth 60 Guilder. You didn't explain what you thought the Indians should have received instead of the beads. Personally I would have taken the Mercedes, but not sure about the availability of premium unleaded gas back in 1626 (I know for a fact that there were no HD TV stations and no Dolby digital 5.1 surround sound back then).
But you instantly switch gears and complain about the Indians ripping off the Europeans by selling the same piece of land multiple times (which you got from my post) as if you somehow knew this all the time and that it has something to do with Thaksin. The cunning of your logic is way over my head.
Your last comment about scapegoats in the USA suggests that you don't really believe in democracy for any country, which is "breath of fresh air" and reveals as nicely as one could wish your true feeling about voting and the democratic process (i.e., democracy is only a good idea if you personally agree with the people who are elected).
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:08 pm on May 4, 2010
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haam sup
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My scorecard says:
Mr.Alan/Adventure Guy - 0
The brothers 'K' - 1
hs
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 7:40 pm on May 4, 2010
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koolbreez
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Mr. Alan, It has nothing to do with who is elected, it is how they are elected.
If the person voting elects a candidate solely because that candidate payed the most money, and intimidated the voter for his vote, then that is not a freely elected Democratic candidate. That is how Thaksin came into power, and how 2 other candidates after him came into power, through vote buying, and intimidation.
With Thaksin's last snap election, he even turned the voting stands around so his people could visably see how a person voted, to make sure that voter was voting for Thaksin. Secret ballot, hardly. That election was thrown out because of that widespread fraud, and Thaksin at that time was kicked out of office. Do you hold only those people that were watching the voters responsible, a scapegoat, or do you hold the result of that fraud responsible? That is not a free Democratically elected official, and the voting commission agreed, and threw Thaksin out of office, held all the executives responsible, thus disbanding the party. Thaksin took it upon himself to appoint himself caretaker PM until the next elections, during that time he was permanantly thown out by the coup, the ONLY way to get rid of his corrupt ways. When the coup happened Thaksin's party had been convicted of widespread voter fraud. Do you leave the result of that fraud in office?
Like I have always said, it's not who is in office, it's how they got there. Thaksin didn't get into office under a free Democratic process, and my question still stands. Do you leave the result of that widespread fraud in office?
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:33 pm on May 4, 2010
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from koolbreez on 8:33 pm on May 4, 2010
Like I have always said, it's not who is in office, it's how they got there. Thaksin didn't get into office under a free Democratic process, and my question still stands. Do you leave the result of that widespread fraud in office?
Each individual person found guilty of crime may be ineligible to hold office, if that is what the laws says (preferably not newly created laws enforced retroactively). But I do not believe one can ban an entire political party on the basis of what other individuals have done.
In addition, I don't believe the totality of the voting fraud accusations you state against the party. I believe they were largely drummed up charges to placate the yellow shirts and get them out of the airport a couple of years ago. In the areas where Thaksin's party won seats in the Parliament, were there really very many closely contested elections? My guess is that whatever improper actions occurred on either side had little impact on the final number of seats in Parliament won by the various parties. For whatever reasons, Thaksin's party is very strong in the rural areas, and there is not much that can be done to change that, regardless of who you put in jail or banish to foreign lands.
In Western countries with fairly advanced democratic traditions, many women voters will choose the male candidate who is the best looking, regardless of any other factors. Probably the majority of voters have similar prejudices or have significant pressures placed on them to vote a certain way by family or peers. That's just part of human nature and our society, and there is not much that can be done about it.
But as Winston Churchill stated, "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time."
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:14 am on May 5, 2010
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from haam sup on 7:40 pm on May 4, 2010
My scorecard says:
Mr.Alan/Adventure Guy - 0
The brothers 'K' - 1
Au contraire.
The brothers 'K' struck out.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:20 am on May 5, 2010
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S M E G M A
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Quote: from Adventure Guy on 11:46 pm on May 4, 2010
... you could learn much from Mr. Alan...
And all of a sudden Adventure Guy makes Alan's day bringing him lots of joy.
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:36 am on May 5, 2010
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koolbreez
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You crack me up...lolol. Thaksin was thrown out of office under laws from the 1997 constitution, not new retroactive laws...lolol. He was convicted of corruption, and abuse of power, by his own court while his brother-in-law was PM.
He came into power by buying votes (the actual handing out of cash to a voter), illegal under every Democratic country in the world, even Thailand, under old laws.
You seem to feel that only those that actually handed out the cash should be held responsible, and he should still be in office because of their actions. It wasn't just a few radicals, it was widespread throughout all of NorthEastern Thailand.
I have to laugh at your use of ideology, when in fact it has nothing to do at all in how Thaksin came into power, and how he left power. He is still playing the same game trying to get back the money that was confiscated from his corruption, and still trying to get back into power, but you seem to think that is ok. It's almost like you support corruption, when if fact he was convicted under old laws of corruption, and abuse of power.......lolol.
Every executive in his party knew what was going on, yet they turned a blind eye. Are they guiltless?....lololol. You seem to think so. The election commission, under old laws, felt differently than you, and found them all guilty, banned them from politics for 5 years, and disbanded their party. Afterall without any executives there is no party.
Your views foster the continuation of corruption, and I don't agree with them plain, and simple.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 4:06 am on May 5, 2010
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Shredded Wheat
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 6:19 pm on May 3, 2010
...Since the current Thai government was installed into power via a military coup, and was kept in power in spite of being defeated at the polls in the next election, it should be the current party in power that is banned. This is common sense...
Don't talk crap Mr A!
+ well said Koolbreez (post above this).
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:28 am on May 5, 2010
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