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Shredded Wheat
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 12:41 am on May 6, 2010
...I am for an end to illegal disruptions and occupations by both sides, yellow and red, and to a restoration of the democratic process. I am for Thailand.
Well said Mr A, I am with you on that point; and I would hope all other posters are too. 
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:01 am on May 6, 2010
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expatchuck
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errrrr, ummmm. The latest news release is the Yellow Shirts have now demanded PM Abbhisit's immediate resignation.
It seems his setting a date for the dissolution of parliament did not make them very happy.
The children are not playing nicely.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 9:04 am on May 6, 2010
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Kaymanx
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The yellows are at least demonstrating their party can question and criticise their leader unlike the one-man show so strenuously defended here.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:42 am on May 6, 2010
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expatchuck
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What the yellows are criticizing seem to be anybody that dares to try and stand up to them.
Just my Isaan observation, Kaymanx, and I didn't like Thaksin either.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 11:07 am on May 6, 2010
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haam sup
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 12:31 am on May 6, 2010
The end does not justify the means. No matter how corrupt Thaksin is, dispensing with democracy is not the proper solution. I would support the demand that Thailand have fresh elections and that democracy be restored, and the military take a back seat in deciding who will run the country.
When are you going to wake up?
There never HAS been a real democracy in this part of the world. What pretense of democracy is demonstrated in Thailand is a sop to its former status as a US regional ally. Same-same the "War on Drugs". Left to their own devices, without the big stick of US foreign aid being wielded, the Thai form of government would still be pure sakdina, with a thin veneer of constitutional monarchy to promote the appearance of modernity.
All of you who believe that democracy is the be-all, end-all of world government should stay home, or at least keep your mouths shut when in other people's back yard. Leave your cold-war education and mentality at the airport gate.
This is Thailand.
Furthermore, democracy is NOT necessarily a prerequisite for success. Look at Singapore. Look at China. You can argue that those states are repressive, and you wouldn't want to live there, but the fact remains that, as states, they are wildly successful.
The Thais seem perfectly happy with vote-buying, power politics, and the like. And at least some are happy with the Army stepping in to reset the system every few years, as evidenced by the frequency with which they do it. The REAL problem will occur when that which is unspeakable comes to pass. But it is THEIR system. Watch it, and realize that your Western conveniently selective moralism is wholly inapplicable to Thailand.
hs
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:48 pm on May 6, 2010
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S M E G M A
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Well said H-S.
Quote: from haam sup on 8:48 am on May 7, 2010
... without the big stick of US foreign aid being wielded, the Thai form of government would still be pure sakdina...
Gotta love the Sakdina system of justice and how witnesses just by showing up would have their points (according to their "na") added to the side they supported, without testifying!! The side that got more points would win the case. Depending on their "na" people would contribute different number of points.
As crazy as it may sound, it made some sense. A high ranking person would cost more to bribe, thus his/her weight at trial was higher than that of, say a farmer.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:03 pm on May 6, 2010
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from haam sup on 8:48 pm on May 6, 2010
When are you going to wake up?
There never HAS been a real democracy in this part of the world. What pretense of democracy is demonstrated in Thailand is a sop to its former status as a US regional ally. Same-same the "War on Drugs". Left to their own devices, without the big stick of US foreign aid being wielded, the Thai form of government would still be pure sakdina, with a thin veneer of constitutional monarchy to promote the appearance of modernity.
All of you who believe that democracy is the be-all, end-all of world government should stay home, or at least keep your mouths shut when in other people's back yard. Leave your cold-war education and mentality at the airport gate.
This is Thailand.
Furthermore, democracy is NOT necessarily a prerequisite for success. Look at Singapore. Look at China. You can argue that those states are repressive, and you wouldn't want to live there, but the fact remains that, as states, they are wildly successful.
The Thais seem perfectly happy with vote-buying, power politics, and the like. And at least some are happy with the Army stepping in to reset the system every few years, as evidenced by the frequency with which they do it. The REAL problem will occur when that which is unspeakable comes to pass. But it is THEIR system. Watch it, and realize that your Western conveniently selective moralism is wholly inapplicable to Thailand.
I am not trying to impose anything on Thailand. There are plenty of Thai people in the streets right now demanding new elections without any encouragement from me or anyone else in the West, so your observations of who is happy and who is not happy may be influenced by your own views on the subject matter (or your circle of acquaintances).
Just because something happens frequently (military coups) does not mean people are happy with it (even the military).
Regarding how successful China has been, I believe that Taiwan has been infinitely more successful. Also, although PRC is not like a Western democracy, their economic gains in last few decades have tracked along with the lessoning of central rule compared to the days of Chairman Mao.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:48 am on May 7, 2010
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China Sailor
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Quote: from haam sup on 9:48 am on May 7, 2010
Furthermore, democracy is NOT necessarily a prerequisite for success. Look at Singapore. Look at China. You can argue that those states are repressive, and you wouldn't want to live there, but the fact remains that, as states, they are wildly successful.
I gotta call you on that statement HS.
Actually Singapore has elections and several parties, it is just that the PPP controls the purse strings and know how to use them. However the tide is turing as more foreign educated Singaporeans return home. This along with the fact that the new group of PPP leaders do not enjoy 'founding father' status has given the
Opposition parties a chance to pick up more than one or two seats.
As for repressive, I can spend a few hours in suburban London (or New York for that matter) and see more policemen pass by than I have seen on the streets of Singapore in the last 8 years.
Since most of the police are on 'National Service' they are reluctant to do any more than they have to.
In reality, Singapore has certain Out of Bounds markers and as long as you stay inside them you can do what you damn well please.
Same Same as the EU or the US...
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:49 am on May 7, 2010
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Adventure Guy
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Quote: from haam sup on 8:48 am on May 7, 2010
The Thais seem perfectly happy with vote-buying, power politics, and the like.
What an absurd statement.
True that Thais are perfectly happy with vote buying, since all Thais, Red Shirts and yes, Yellow Shirts, that you so blindly defend and absolve in all of this.
But "perfectly happy with power politics"? ???
The last I heard significant thousands are willing to fight to the death, with a majority of the rural folks back home, and no doubt a majority of all Thais, as unhappy with the power politics that replaced two of their elected leaders by illegal coup and political processes by their cronies in quick succession, while continuing to stall until they can change the constitution and army leadership in September to solidify a complete urban power lockout.
But your ignorance is excused because you obviously haven't heard anything about their rather unhappy state of affairs and so base your ramblings only on a somewhat strange mindset and such erroneous statements throughout.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 1:56 am on May 7, 2010
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haam sup
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China Sailor: I defer to you, since you have more time on the ground in Sing. than I will, ever. But it still illustrates my point, which was not primarily about Singapore, but about the fact that democracy is not a PRE-REQUISITE for a state's success. And I doubt that you will argue that within Singapore's formative years, when it ate the region for lunch, it was a real democracy, regardless of how close it approximates one now.
As for Adventure guy: do you not understand that the Red Shirt 'movement' is the mirror of the Yellow shirt movement: both are about power. The difference is that an (currently) outside agitator is using the poor as a pawn in a power re-grab. Don't think for a minute that this is about poor, disenfranchised farmers, yearning to participate in the electoral process. This is about corrupt, disenfranchised bosses, regaining some of the power promised them by Square Head.
If you think this is about democracy, better get some time on the ground in Isaan. Have you lived there? I have. Do you have friends on BOTH sides? I have.
The only discontent with the power politics lies, as usual, with those who have lost the power. When/if they regain it, they will sit fat, dumb, and happy, while the other side will become disenchanted with the process, ad infinitum. The poor will remain so, and take refuge in the Dhamma.
Do I wish there was less suffering among the poor? Of course. Do I wish to tell them how to achieve it? f*** no.
As for the absurdity of my statement: the real absurdity is that you know so little, yet speak without reservation. Like learning Thai, listening is key.
Mr. Alan: the point is that until Square Head started rabble-rousing, 18 or so coups occurred, without any mass demonstrations from Isaan. Happy? I guess we could pick on that word, but there hasn't been sufficient discontent, say, as compared with the colonists in America rising up against King George, having the original tea party, etc. Democracy foist upon a populace has no more chance of succeeding than tyranny. If it springs from the hearts you seem to wish to exist in Thailand, it will grow. I just don't think there is a reincarnated Jefferson in Udon.
The point is that you bring baggage to the discussion, just as many of us have in the past. When you lose some of it, you'll appreciate Thailand for what it is, NOT for what you wish it would be.
hs
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:19 pm on May 7, 2010
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