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Blattsucker
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Ok, let me try to answer Manowar and Expatchuck at the same time. One agreeing a bit and one NOT agreeing one bit. This should be an interesting experiment.
"What I would like to see you do is tell us what you would have done, had you been President of the US when 9/11 occured."
Well, what I did, on the otherside of the ocean in an unimportant job when the 2nd plane hit, was drop my work and started to gather information. I knew this was war. What did George do? He finished reading his petgoat. This is how your commander in chief sees his priorities.
War on Afghanistan : Good. War on Iraq : Bad.
In the first he had about every country in the world behind him. Dozens of countries did partake in a first strike against the Taliban. Among them a lot of muslim countries. So far so good.
But when George started lying about Iraq, he lost his coalition. This turned the world against him. Inside a year???? This is very strange. As american you have to ask yourself what happened. In 2001 you got more friends then you can handle and in 2003 they all have become your enemy. From loving you, we started hating you. Only George happened in that year. So you practicly singlehandedly invaded Iraq. Not good, but could be nessesary. At the time I was 50% - 50%, infavor or against the war. If I had to go, I would wait a month and get me some more friends that were also 50-50.
With my current knowledge I would forget Iraq and build me some dikes in New Orleans, but that would be cheating.
"Give us your solutions to this terrorist problem."
Sorry I'm not God, we are also not on speaking terms. I have no solutions. But I can point out some mistakes that were made. Which could help in finding a solution.
"What should we do?"
Well, what we should NOT do is what Manowar said. Attack some country just for the heck of it. That would give every muslim in the world a reason to hate the USA. Even more then they do already. And inside the US I think George did a good job by not making this a "muslim" thing. But by attacking Iraq this message was lost to every muslim outside the US.
"To whom should we do it?"
Again, NOT to innocent people. But finding not so innocent people is a bit harder.
"Should Europe be involved, if France will let them?"
Yes, since the terrorrists are everywhere. There is one living free and happy just one mile from my house. So don't come to me about being a coward and far from any danger. This guy wanted to go to Pakistan for some basictraining and did rob a supermarket with an AK-47. Firearms are very rare here, so an AK-47 is something like using a nuke. The day we opened his PC (or one of his friends) was the day tanks appeard on your Wall-Street. By the way, 60 years ago Bali was MY country and a lot of dutch were in the cafe. So this hits close to home for me also, even on the other side of the globe.
"When should we do it?"
When you can. A.S.A.P. But pray it is the right thing.
"Give us specifics, please. We are thirsting to drink from the fount of your knowledge. You nuclear physicists are saying that the terrorism that is abounding in the world now and in the past is a result of GWB and his relationship with God?"
Funny that you say this. I was just coming to it. Yes and no. In the past would be a bit difficult, so that is the NO. But the HERE and NOW........ the only possible answer would be YES!
What did George do wrong in Iraq? He lost the peace. How? After the war he was stupid enough to disband the iraqy army. This is more stupidity then one man can possibly handle, but George did not even blink once.
You also don't get it???? Well, what do you get when you have the fourth biggest army and inside 5 minutes you turn them into jobless men without income but they still have a gun in their hands?????? Still need some help??? Answer : the biggest f***ing mess, you can inmagine, we call it Iraq.
You got an enormous amount of men with guns and no way to support their family. So why was George surprised of all the looting, murder, mayhem and kidnappings????? I wasn't!
A solution for Iraq? You lost that the day he disbanded the army.
Now to terrorrism. What did George do for it after 9/11. He did everything FOR it and only a few things AGAINST it.
Against it : he shut down training camps in Afghanistan.
For it : Instead of trained terrorrists we have now battle hardened veteran terrorrists coming out of Iraq. He made some weekend warriors into rambo's. Thanks George!
Against it : he killed / captured some middlemen of Al-Qaida and some footsoldiers. But he did not cut off the head of the snake.
For it : He created a new Al-Qaida. One that is a hydra. No more heads to cut off. There are now single cells all over the world. Getting Bin Laden now is fun, but strategic unimportant. BL is now just a figurehead, not the masterbrain he was.
Against it : he made the US look strong in Afghanistan. Weird nations started to tremble.
For it : he made the US look weak in Iraq. Everybody with a peashooter now thinks he can make a dent in your armor.
It is time somebody explained the word IRONY to George. After 9/11 he got all the voters behind him for all the wrong reasons. After Katrina he is losing all the voters for all the wrong reasons.
Who says there is no justice?
And about me personaly. If you put me in a room with OBL and GWB and a gun with only 1 bullit, the outcome would be the same as if any of you were in my place. Only difference would be that I know there are no Knights-in-shining-white-armor in that room. Whereas some of you are a bit more naive on that front.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:19 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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expatchuck
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Quote: from DaffyDuck on 2:21 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
Quote: from bkkfella on 4:33 am on Oct. 3, 2005
First..... I am sure GB never ever said he speaks to God. So why do you embarrass yourself by saying such a silly thing ?
Bzzzzzzt!
http://www.economist.com/world/na/displayStory.cfm?story_id=3502861
http://www.counterpunch.org/floyd06302003.html
Nothing wrong, per se, in believing in God, and thinking that God talks to you -- only problem is that God lives in a really small portion of your brain, and only talks to you when you suffer a temporal lobe epileptic seizure... Maybe some of these people claiming a mandate from God should be examined... Would be interesting what one would find:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/2865009.stm
Seriously, Daffy, you should read these links before you post them.
Your first link to the Economist says, in part....
"Mr. Bush is in fact in the mainstream of recent presidents. As Michael Cromartie of the Ethics and Public Policy Centre points out, Jimmy Carter taught Sunday School while president. Bill Clinton talked about Jeses more often than Mr. Bush and has spoken in more churches than Mr. Bush has had rubber-chicken dinners."
Your second link quotes the source of his article as a Middle East newspaper the Haaretz and your piece is written by one Chris Floyd, a columnist for the MOSCOW TIMES.
I haven't wasted my time reading your newly edited-in link to the BBC and probably won't.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 2:30 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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expatchuck
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Quote: from Cerberus on 2:37 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
Quote: from expatchuck on 12:56 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
It seemed to work pretty well on 6 and 9 August 1945.
Advice on senility status of Bush and his clique urgently required.
....and this means exactly what????
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:33 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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expatchuck
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I just typed for half an hour and this f***ing computer deleted everything.
BS, you are wrong but I don't have the energy to prove it today. I leave tonight for Thailand and will answer your oh-so misdirected post if I can.
Now. see if this thing goes through.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 3:36 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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bkkfella
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Quote: from Blattsucker on 8:28 am on Oct. 3, 2005
"Jews killed, Paletinian's displaced. So who is the bad guy there?"
Yep, you are a real fountain of knowledge. From which turnipcart did you just fall? Displaced! Do you have any idea what you are talking about? No, let me explain. In 1948 the UN gave the (homeless) jews a piece of land that you now know as Israel. There was only a very small problem. That piece of land was home to 5 - 10 million palestinians. They got kicked out.
So you have millions of people with out possessions (land) and sent to places where nobody wanted them. They were confined in small pieces of land without ANYTHING. No possessions, no jobs, no income, no sanitation.
First of all, the Jews occupied Israel 1000 years before Mohammad was born. The Romans and then the British took it away from them. No one (the UN) gave them anything they did not already rightfully have claim to.
And the Jews were already there in 1948 for more than 50 years... as refugees, not as citizens.
Second, why are the Palastinians homeless as you say ?Good question !!!
For goodness sake, there is land 100x the size of Israel right there in the form of other Arab states. Why do they (the Arabs) not help their brothers with some of their abundance ? It is because they want to drive the Jews into the sea at any cost and are using the P's as the tool. They are as cruel to the P's as they are to the Jews.
You really should refain from Ad Hominem attacks directed at me and concentrate on getting your facts straight.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 4:09 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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Hermanolobo
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The US has got its 'New Viet-Nam' and you cannot turn back the clock.
What conerns me is the South of Thailand and the possibility that Phuket or Pattaya etc could face the same fate as Bali.
With Iraq the 'hornets nest' has been stirred and will fester.
The Muslims conveniently have replaced the Soviet Union as THE threat.
The West pulls out of Iraq. Then there is civil war proper amongst the Shia & Sunni and then Iran steps in to help its 'brothers' ? Some psychic predicted once that Iran would take over Jordan. They'd have to be in Iraq first.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:06 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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China Sailor
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Quote: from expatchuck on 3:25 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
I think that HST was, indeed, a good man and I am sure he labored over the decision to drop the bomb. I would not have had such a problem.
Not to screw the thread but an article in the August issue of 'The Bulliten of Atomic Scientists' discussed the actual decision to drop the Bomb and it seems that only State and HST wanted to drop it. The War Department and Marshall wanted to wait until the Soviets declared against the Japanese to see if they would surrender then.
The real reason to drop the bomb was not just to save American lives but to show the Soviets that we had it and they better not make trouble in Europe.
BTW this article was based on the papers of someone who was involved in the decision process...
As for the attack on BALI: I believe that the best response is to hold one hell of a party on Kuta beach complete with free flowing booze, naked women, and loads of BBQ pork.
The best way to hold off a mad dog is to show no fear!
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 6:54 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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Brown Eye
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Quote: from expatchuck on 2:25 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
Many people that hate GWB so much seem to forget that Germany never attacked the US, yet we declared war on them and helped in their defeat.
Dear Mr. Expatchuck, allow me to correct you in this minor point you made. Although you are right that Germany had not yet attacked the USA besides the sinking of some cargo ships in convoys to the British Isles, it was Germany that declared war on the USA first. This was following the Japanese attack to PH, Hawai. Hitler was hoping Japan would reciprocate and declare war to Russia and attack it in the east. Japan didn't reciprocate.
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:48 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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Blattsucker
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BKKfella, you realy should go back to kindergarten and learn to read.
"You really should refain from Ad Hominem attacks directed at me and concentrate on getting your facts straight."
My facts are straight, the only problem is you did not notcice them in my post. I said : "... and sent to places where nobody wanted them." Notice the word NOBODY. Since there are a lot of arab countries around Israel, it would speak for itself that the word NOBODY would include a lot of arabs. This is very understandable if you think how YOU would feel when somebody placed a million hobo's in your backyard. I'm sure it would piss you off. (Also notice how I included the word ARABS in the shooting part of my post.)
Expatchuck, don't bother proving me wrong. I bet a large sum of money that you are not the man that proves me wrong, since you are mixing EMOTION with FACTS.
FACT is that George killed more people (is responsible for) then Osama. I don't think Osama killed more then 10.000 people with his terror attacks. That was just an hour worth of carpetbombing the Iraqy national guard for George.
EMOTION is that Osama killed innocent civilians and George killed soldiers (that asked for it).
Let me give an example of what YOU are discussing about. Let's say you have a wife and kids. Let's say I have a car.
Fact is I run your wife and kids over with my car. They are dead. Reasons for me to do this.
1) I saw them from a mile away and thought BONUSPOINTS WHEN HIT.
2) I was drunk and lost control of my car.
3) Your family jumped out from behind a truck infront of my bumper.
Now do you care about my reasons???? Does it make any difference to you??? I don't think so. But for a far away judge it realy makes a big difference.
So don't argue with me about lives lost are fact or fiction. That you will lose. Argue with me about : Was it all worth it? There you can score points.
But never forget that the wife of a NY stockbroker grieves just as hard as the wife of an iraqy soldier. And both wives did not ask for this.
All I am saying is that there are 2 sides to this medal and you see only one side. I'm showing you the other side. The value you give to one side or the other is up to you. Just don't expect the whole world to have the exact same (american) values. Americans have the same right to be wrong as anybody else.
And to take China Sailors thought a bit further.
Let's say HST was a total bastard and he dropped the bombs for no good reason.
Now WHAT IF........ HST was a nice guy and he did NOT drop them??????? What would happen then????
I think JFK was the closest to ever come to exchange some nukes with the USSR. Would his (and C's) reservations be as great as they were if the bombs were still untested on human cities??? I don't think it is a big leap of faith to think they would have pushed the button a lot faster then they did. And I don't think we would be alive or able to read this forum if they did.
Just a random thought.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 10:48 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from expatchuck on 2:58 pm on Oct. 3, 2005
I haven't wasted my time reading your newly edited-in link to the BBC and probably won't.
I wouldn't expect you to learn something interesting that might expand your opinions, seeing as how they are as fortified as they are.
Heck, why confuse you with facts -- and seeing as how you haven't bothered reading any of the articles yourself, I am am surprised of you chastising me of not reading them. Funny, even.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 10:56 am on Oct. 3, 2005
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