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manowar
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Quote: from Smegma on 9:11 am on Mar. 9, 2005
He keeps proving my point. LOL
So funny!!
Challenge? He wishes; different league. Not even worth considering him as an opponent.
Why would I want to go down to a lower league ? It's cooler when you are on higher ground.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 2:53 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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Smegma
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That comeback is embarrassing. So lacking of any real punch. So childish. 
But thanks. You are proving my point about YOU not being a worthy opponent. Obviously you didn't even understand my comment -which doesn't surprise me- and now make a poor attempt at sounding half smart.
Hopefully this will not turn into another of those unending silly obsessions of yours where you do not let go -like the one where you kept going for weeks asking is Japan was in Asia or not.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 3:20 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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scobie
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As an aside, I never understand why people insist on calling China a communist country. After 1949 when it centrally controlled both the economy and restricted people's freedoms (one party state, repression, press censorship etc), it could be called communist in the way we think of communist countries.
But now? A relatively free market economy and a controlled political system with very few freedoms for individuals. Last time I checked that was the hallmarks of a facist state.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:11 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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Broken Leg
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But now? A relatively free market economy and a controlled political system with very few freedoms for individuals. Last time I checked that was the hallmarks of a facist state.
are you talking about China here or the US
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 5:13 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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ABC
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Quote: from manowar on 11:42 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
ABC, I wouldn't be so sure about how mighty your blue (US) passport is. Pls read this before you take your next trip to China :http://www.asianweek.com/2001_04_27/news4_chinesedetainees.html
Read the article and there are some distinct differences with him and me. He's an author with foreign ties. I'm just an average person (tourist). If the Chinese government wants to make a statement, then detaining me won't do it. I don't think I'm that important. ha ha ha!!
And we are talkin' about the 5th person detained. Until the # hit's 25% of the # of American vistors are detained, I'm not that concerned.
Like I pointed out, you have a great chance of getting detained in Thailand for trash talkin' the King, then in China for talkin' smack about the government. Something I would like to add I would not encourage anyone to do in either country.
Read up on the Cultural Revolution and better yet, go see the movie " Farewell, my concubine". You can get it in any Blockbuster Video store in the Bay Area. If you are truly interested in finding out more the difference between Taiwan and China, watch the Chinese language news channel on Channel 26 and ask your parents to translate for you or PM me.
And are you assuming that just because I'm an ABC that I don't speak chinese??
Regardless, I don't need to see a movie with Gong Li to explain to me the difference between China and Taiwan. I've been to both countries plenty of times. And I'd much rather see Zhang Ziyi then Gong li!! ha ha ha!!
Infact, if you know about the "chinese love boat" in the 80's you can understand that I've had enough exposure to the Taiwan government and their propoganda against mainland China.
I'm not saying China is good and Taiwan is bad. I'm actually neutral.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:45 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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Hermanolobo
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Quote: from ABC on 6:39 pm on Mar. 10, 2005[brZhang Ziyi then Gong li!! ha ha ha!!
Ziyi Zhang ! 
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 7:15 am on Mar. 10, 2005
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from manowar on 2:42 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
BTW< they have just found out who the gunner was who shot at Ah Bien during the last Presidential election in Taiwan.
...and he had conveniently drowned himself right after the shooting - I guess it took this long to extract the confession from the corpse. 
Looks to me like the work of a pretty depressed guy, very unhappy with the government, that drove him to his actions.
Kinda like a 'lone shooter on a grassy knoll'.
In all seriousness, I do think it was a legitimate shooting attempt, and not a staged fishing for sympathy.
Dr. von Quack!
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 12:09 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
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manowar
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Quote: from ABC on 2:39 am on Mar. 10, 2005
Quote: from manowar on 11:42 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
ABC, I wouldn't be so sure about how mighty your blue (US) passport is. Pls read this before you take your next trip to China :http://www.asianweek.com/2001_04_27/news4_chinesedetainees.html
Read the article and there are some distinct differences with him and me. He's an author with foreign ties. I'm just an average person (tourist). If the Chinese government wants to make a statement, then detaining me won't do it. I don't think I'm that important. ha ha ha!!
And we are talkin' about the 5th person detained. Until the # hit's 25% of the # of American vistors are detained, I'm not that concerned.
Like I pointed out, you have a great chance of getting detained in Thailand for trash talkin' the King, then in China for talkin' smack about the government. Something I would like to add I would not encourage anyone to do in either country.
Read up on the Cultural Revolution and better yet, go see the movie " Farewell, my concubine". You can get it in any Blockbuster Video store in the Bay Area. If you are truly interested in finding out more the difference between Taiwan and China, watch the Chinese language news channel on Channel 26 and ask your parents to translate for you or PM me.
And are you assuming that just because I'm an ABC that I don't speak chinese??
Regardless, I don't need to see a movie with Gong Li to explain to me the difference between China and Taiwan. I've been to both countries plenty of times. And I'd much rather see Zhang Ziyi then Gong li!! ha ha ha!!
Infact, if you know about the "chinese love boat" in the 80's you can understand that I've had enough exposure to the Taiwan government and their propoganda against mainland China.
I'm not saying China is good and Taiwan is bad. I'm actually neutral.
OK. In the 80's, Taiwan was no different than China today. I will agree with that. It was a one party state controled by KMT. What we are comparing are the two countries TODAY. Taiwan is in the infancy of democracy. Think back to when US was in its infancy of democracy. It was just as chaotic, unpreditable, violent...... ( Iraq today). We from the western democractic countries should support and give credit to countries that are just beginning to experience democracy, even with all its flaws and loopholes. As to you can speak Chinese, that's great! I am always proud of second generation Americans who remember and maintian their cultural ties to their ancestral land. "Ni gian kuo yu, ma ?"
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:15 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from manowar on 1:09 am on Mar. 11, 2005
What we are comparing are the two countries TODAY. Taiwan is in the infancy of democracy. (...) We from the western democractic countries should support and give credit to countries that are just beginning to experience democracy, even with all its flaws and loopholes.
I think that's really the issue here - dredging up how Taiwan *was* 25 years ago. as opposed to China today is pointless.
The real question is, considering that Taiwan is starting to go down the path of democracy, would such a democratic ideology be maintained if it were absorbed by China?
Exactly!...and that's why the US should support Taiwan, and not China.
The problem with China's 'rogue province' rethoric is that Formosa/Taiwan was never China's to start with, so how can it be a province, rogue or not --- furthermore, if it is indeed a 'rogue province' then why do they need armies, and international arguments to justify 'unification' (a word the frequently use) - heck, if it's just another province, then why can't they send their own troops in without provoking an international incident?
The only reason China wants Taiwan is or their industry and economy, and because their democracy and economic success is a thorn in their side - tough considering Taiwan's investment's in China, and the previous atmosphere of collaboration, I fail to see what they hope to gain by rattling sabres.
Dr. von Quack!
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 2:36 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
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Smegma
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Quote: from DaffyDuck on 2:30 am on Mar. 11, 2005
.... The problem with China's 'rogue province' rethoric is that Formosa/Taiwan was never China's to start with, so how can it be a province, rogue or not....
.... The only reason China wants Taiwan is or their industry and economy, and because their democracy and economic success is a thorn in their side....
Are you serious Darfy? I expected an intellectual like you to know better.
It is true that for a long time Formosa was kind of nobody's land -though receiving a continuous influx of mainland chinese for centuries. However, Formosa became already formally part of China sometime in the 19th century. But then China gave it to Japan in "perpeuity" after loosing the Sino-Japanese war at the end of the century. Formosa then became part of the empire of the rising sun.
At the end of WWII, the allies let Chiang take over Formosa -at the time he still held parts of mainland China. Now, remember Chiang was fighting the communists and had he won and taken over all of the mainland, he would have kept Formosa as part of China.
At first the local Taiwanese were happy being part of China (?) under Chiang but then started to resent his government and there were some protests that were brutally repressed resulting in thousands of dead in 1947. This was the same kind of repression practised by China's communist governments. One not much better than the other.
Then in 1949 Chiang lost the war and all he had in mainland China and was only left with Formosa.
Formosa was nobody's, then Chinese, then Japanese and then Chinese again by virtue of Chiang taking it for China under his rule (as decided by the victorious allied powers). Had the KMT prevailed and defeated Mao, China today would include Formosa. Taiwanese governments first policies were always pro-unification with the mainland -however with them as the leaders and not under the communists.
As to China wanting Taiwan 'only' because of its industry and economy, that is not exactly correct. Though those are reasons that now certainly reinforce China's desire for getting Taiwan, its policy of reunification existed long before Taiwan became one the sucessful Tiger economies of Asia.
Before the end of WWII it was already agreed by Roosevelt, Churchill and Chiang that "Manchuria, Formosa, and the Pescadores shall be restored to the Republic of China."
The problem was that then there were two Chinese governments. Funny thing is that both Chinese Governments, of course, claim Formosa and the Pescadores as Chinese soil on the basis of ancient historical connection, the predominantly "Chinese" ethnic origin of the population, and the Cairo Declaration, which stipulated that "Formosa and the Pescadores shall be restored to the Republic of China." The issue then was not if Formosa was Chinese or not, but which goverment was the legitimate one for China (one China). This issue still remains the key one to this day. And this is why Taiwan is no longer a member of the UN.
All this may not be very relevant today to the Taiwanese who now just want to be independent. But many of the locals also wanted to be independent back then before Chiang took Formosa for China from the Japanese. Difference is now it is for very different reasons that they want to be "independent."
* Side Note: An American diplomat, George Kerr, who was stationed in Taipei and witnessed the first few years of Chiang's rule wrote his views on a book he titled "Formosa Betrayed." In there he writes:
After the Japanese surrender in 1945, the Formosans, despite the Cairo Declaration, hoped for a guaranteed neutrality under American or international trusteeship. Instead, they were delivered over to another and more oppressive occupation.
Their prosperous society was invaded by a horde of mainland Chinese, often brutal, ignorant, and greedy -- the dregs of the Nationalist army. The new governor, under orders, bled the island dry, ruthlessly and with dispatch.
Yet still the Formosans hoped. American propaganda, promising freedom to all oppressed peoples, and citing the glorious Revolution of 1776, continued to pour in upon them. In February 1947 unarmed Formosans rose en masse to demand reforms in the administration at Taipei. Chiang Kai-shek's answer was a brutal massacre. Thousands died -- first among them were the leaders who had asked for American help. Washington turned a deaf ear, while the Chinese communists rejoiced.
After Chiang's military collapse and retreat to Formosa the situation became even worse. As American emotional commitment to Chiang became more fervent, Formosan hope for American or United Nations intervention or understanding faded and died.
Kerr's book is free and available online. It is very informative and IMO interesting -though a bit lacking in the narrative style (some may find it very boring).
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:10 pm on Mar. 10, 2005
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