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Vancouver Jay
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Thinking without overthinking.
@NM -- My cock works fine even on the rare occasion I try to use it and my brain at the same time. The "root" of the problem is the formation and use of sensible rules.
By way of example, there are certain rules for driving: use your turn signals, look left and right before pulling out, etc. All with the goal of safe operation and survival.
My goal is the same. I know people make mistakes behind the wheel: usually you make it through okay, sometimes you get a ticket, rarely you get dead. To err is human.
But these are my rules and they didn't spring forth fully formed like some Heuristic Deity of yore: I had to think through them, factoring in the nature of my relationship, my ability to manufacture cover stories as needed, my tolerance of risk. They are more personal than traffic law, more internalized, and the shock of having blown off a lot of them so casually is what has me shook up.
I'm glad you can just get up and go and I envy you for that, but my situation demands that I be more planned and circumspect.
@Arky -- Well said, and thank you. She is Thai, but I'd prefer to set boundaries on my own behavior so she doesn't have to adapt at all.
If she has been raised to believe that all men are dogs who will jump the fence eventually (alert the mixed metaphor police again!), then the best gift I can give her is the appearance that her man is different. It doesn't take anything like spectacular sacrifice on my part, just some sensible rules stringently adhered to.
I don't have itchy feet in the sense that I need a "faen noi" or second girlfriend. The fact that the girl I pulled out of the fishbowl Annie's last night was my first ever repeater was entirely accidental, at least on a conscious level: she was just the best looker available. (But on the other hand I don't recall even trying to recall my list of previously-used badge numbers there. And that's what is troubling.)
I just like a little variety now and then. I'm not naive enough to try to derive any ego-boost from it: the girls will f*ck anybody with a wallet who's half-way clean, after all. It's not conquest, or proving "I've still got it" or anything like that. It's just for fun.
My girl... There's her feelings, and there's her face. I'd rather preserve both. I tell her where I'm going and with whom as a matter of course, because there's always one more sister than you know about, i.e. her friend or relative you haven't met yet.
If she ever gets a call on her phone that Jay is here or there, she already knows. And the mystery cousin will have nothing to report because it's just me and the boys pounding beers, or on the truly rare occasion that we (the puntbunch) go to the "happy zone", like GT or a gogo, I keep a one meter perimeter that no "lady working" can enter.
I'm a freaking paragon of virtue in her eyes up to this point (with one exception but we shared the blame on that one...) and while I know it is a fraud, it is a very pleasant one for me to give and her to receive.
Maybe it would be better over time to slowly lower her opinion of me, let it slowly deflate to something closer to the standard expectations a Thai girl has of a man's behavior. It would certainly be less stressful.
But I also know myself and I have a streak where if you give me an inch... I trashed several good relationships that way back in Farangland. It sort of stings when my girl says, "It's okay, I trust you." -- I know myself to be inherently untrustworthy on more levels than she has even considered.
So I have a classic dilemma of two equally unpleasant choices: a rules-driven metanoia with the occasional heart-stopping close call and a possible fatal error always lurking just beyond the range of my scope; or start the countdown timer to blowing this relationship.
Since I'm already on the first track, I think I'll avoid change simply for change's sake and just try to take this close shave as a wake-up call to do better in the future.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:06 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Marco
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About the "unspoken 'arrangement' " I would not take the risk.
The Thai newspapers are full of stories of men waking up as post-op katoyes because they *thought* there was and "unspoken arrangement".
I have yet to find a young pretty non-BG that will let you f*ck around and be ok about it.
Maybe when they are 35+, know they cannot compete, don't care anymore and have other interests (the kids or whatever).
Also keep in mind that if she lets you do it, she will certainly not be shy about doing it also.
The image of the submissive TG waiting faithfully at home while her husband is fooling around is IMO a myth. Particularly when you are a farang: they tend to raise up the standards !
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 1:19 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Jazzmusicman
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Very good insight and information from everyone. Vancouver Jay...I am just about to enter into the same situation as you. My Thai girlfriend is coming from Phuket to move in with me here in BKK. I have had the same feelings as you in regards to her "trusting me". I hope we can meet for a beer someday and talk about this. I would be interested in hearing more from you because I agree with most of your thoughts....
Thanks....and good luck.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:30 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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expatchuck
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VJ:
I have presented your problem to both Dr. Ruth and Dr. Phil.
Dr. Phil says you are merely a confused individual trying to find your moral feet in a sea of sinful activity and you are applying the rules you discussed as a means to provide some stability in your life.
Dr. Ruth, however, advises you are subconsciously trying to re-attain the sexual variety you had prior to making your committment to your present companion and you are using the vehicle of promiscuity in order to re-attain this sexual variety. 
That being said, they both seem to agree that you appear to be the type that will follow a stiff dick into places they wouldn't go with a loaded shotgun. 
I hope this eases your dilemma somewhat. 
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 3:33 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Arcadius
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Marco
The Thai newspapers are full of stories of men waking up as post-op katoyes because they *thought* there was and "unspoken arrangement"
Actually, I suspect the usual reason is that they drove a coach and horses through just such an arrangement. Just because the boundaries may be more widely drawn than in farangland, it doesn't follow that there are no boundaries at all. Or that the penalties for over-stepping them aren't severe.
I'd guess the most serious offences are: 1) moving beyond casual sex with professionals to an emotional affair which a TGF/wife considers a real threat, and 2) being so indiscreet as to show complete contempt for her feelings and making her lose face with family & friends.
Granted, in some cases the offences may be relatively minor. We all know that when a TG (or any Thai for that matter) loses it, she is out of control and anything might happen. Even so, guys in LOS who f*ck around and retain their wedding tackle must vastly outnumber those who lose it.
I don't think that TGs are submissive at all, merely that that they have different (and imho far more realistic) expectations of men's sexual behaviour than their farang sisters. How could they grow up in this culture and not have different expectations?
I have yet to find a young pretty non-BG that will let you f*ck around and be ok about it
Well, of course they don't 'let' you. Flaunt it in any TG's face, and you're asking for trouble. It's more a case of them understanding that what they don't know won't hurt them, and expecting you to be sufficiently discreet so that it isn't forced to their attention. What they're not going to do (in the way that an expat wife might) is sit around agonising about what you might be doing when you're out of sight. As you're a man, you can be expected to f*ck around a bit because that's what men do. I think yer average TG is quite capable of pushing this 'knowledge' right to the back of her mind and not letting it upset her. Your job (however much or little you do f*ck around) is to make damn sure it stays right at the back of her mind.
TGs have their own little quirks, of course. A common one is to keep lines of communication open to old BFs &c in case you don't work out. Farangs often complain bitterly about this, but I think that again TGs are only being realistic. After all, youth and beauty don't last very long and men are not very reliable.
LOS is a far cry from farangland. There are no universal rules governing sexual relationships.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:48 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Vancouver Jay
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Hmmmm...
XPC you are the man. First, the lamented and unfulfilled "Bare Wish Project" and now the spiritual father of "Plan C".
I'm going to thrown caution to the wind and just trust that the God I don't believe in truly does protect fools, little children and idiots named Jay.
You -will- pay to have my penis sewed back on, right? 
Thanks for the laugh, man, I needed it.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:53 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Vancouver Jay
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@Arky -- "forced to their attention" summarizes the situation in 4 words as well as anything. In the Thai value system, it seems that in truth ignorance is bliss. But forcing unpleasant facts on someone, making them internalize an external situation, is in very bad taste.
"What they're not going to do (in the way that an expat wife might) is sit around agonising about what you might be doing when you're out of sight."
Too right. When my girl is going out of town, or away, every conversation contains the mild admonishment, "Don't be naughty!" That's partly my fault as on our rounds we always play, all in fun, the go-go bar game of "which one you want?" as regards the dancers.
(For the record, she likes 'em busty and fair, I like 'em willowy and dark.)
So she knows I have a "type" and a discerning eye and her admonishment is probably some variety of her putting her brand on me, mentally if not physically.
But there's no real depth to it, it's almost just a reflex or a running gag between friends. It strikes me as somewhat fatalistic, as does a lot of Eastern and Buddhist thought, as though she's given up hope that I can actually manage NOT to be naughty.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:08 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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Oz
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So VJ, to sumarize this, you want to find a place to shag somebody without yr partner finding out so as to not affect yr relationship? Why use so many words!
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:17 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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NaughtiusMaximus
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He thinks to much...thus he writes to much...
there is an old chinese saying... he who plan to much end up in biggest pile of sh*t.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:24 am on Nov. 17, 2003
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