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Frank La Rue
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As you know I have appoligized to the Doc for calling him a Jerk on basis of me jumping to conclusions. Here is what : wrote him:
"Message title:Max Manus
is a Nowegian war hero from WW2. His work has been made into a major movie running these days. So does the public debate about whether his efforts were good or bad, as the german occupation forces shot sivilians in retaliation to some of his military actions.
I have never observed such heated debate and personal attacks in the press and television, the topic is very loaded.
I would assume under normal circumstances that hardly any on this board know about the issue unless one is Norwegian, like me,
However, you do run tours and meet a lot of people, in a fit of rage I juped to the conclusion - wrongly - that you were being flippant about the issue, the Max Manus and Max in my Anus seemed too similar to be a coincidence.
However, it is a co-incidence. For this I owe you an appology for calling you a jerk and will appologize also publicly on the board.
As for being banned, I am not too worried, most of the fun is gone after the great fall-out a couple of years ago, TWD, Hermano Lobo etc.
The banter with yourself and DD on one side and a lot of members on the other also seems unnecessary.
Again, I appologize for jumping to conlcusions.
As for the the local, Norwegian debate about the value of guerilla resistance versus the consequences of reprisals I think another 20 years are needed so all the particiapnts are dead and the discussion can be held by cooler heads and scolars"
With hindsight the misinterpretation is pretty funny.
As for the debate a - do we resist and have our civilians killed or do we stay low and plan for better times, is an interesting one.
The nature ofthe human psyche seems to be that resistance is morally "good" even if civilians are killed in the aftermath, whereas passive collaboration against an enemy so powerful that resistance is futile, is considered treason.
As a matter of fact the term "Quisling" which is being used also in the engish language is coined from the prime minister of the government which took power in Norway after the German occupation was a fact.
He was tried in court after the war and shot.
The disussion which is yet to be had, here and as a principle of governance, military tactic and interantional law, is, when is it better for common good to fight, and when is it better to collaborate?
I measure "good" here as the price to pay or avoid in terms of civilian lives, damage to infrastructure and other collateral damage.
The discussion in my country has created a lot of waves and animosity - it does not seem that the public is ready for it, or is it an inate instict in human nature that collaboration is morally bad even if overall damage is less?
On a side note, my own father,who isnow dead, joined the resistance, his mother (my grandmother) was taken hostage to force him to surrender.
Together with a small band he attacked the local prison where she was held due to be sent to prison camp in Germany, got her out and toghether with his mother and his then girlfriend - who later gave birth to me - he fled to Sweden.
There he was selected to fighter pilot training in Canada, however the war ended before he saw pilot action.
As for him, he was later able to have the above discussion with a cool head, but not everyone is.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:31 am on Feb. 8, 2009
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DrLove
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Ok, no problem, Frank.
As I replied, we both learned our lessons: me about Max Manus and Frank about jumping to conclusions prematurely.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 8:25 am on Feb. 8, 2009
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Frank La Rue
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Quote: from DrLove on 10:25 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
Don't forget about ELP......
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:57 am on Feb. 8, 2009
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Loung Steeb
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i can not belieb....somebody wants to kill me and somebody wants to blow me...i'm up for grabs
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 4:46 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
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tezza
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Yes the Germans were a pathetic race back in the 1930's/40's. I find it rather amusing how any mention of atrocities by the Germans in WWII somehow gets relabelled as being done by the 'NAZI's' as if they were somehow different & unrelated to an average German. They were not
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:04 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from tezza on 9:04 am on Feb. 9, 2009
As if we needed any better example of the usual lack of cultural and historical education....
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:46 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from Frank La Rue on 4:31 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
As for the debate a - do we resist and have our civilians killed or do we stay low and plan for better times, is an interesting one.
Good question -- my view:
- we know historically there are ALWAYS better times following any bad situation.
- you can't fight evil if you are dead.
- sacrificing your own civilians, for a dubious, at best, advantage is no better than your enemy's actions (just look at Hamas in Israel as an example, who sacrifice their own civilians on purpose, and gain zero - this is given as a counter-example of a bad implementation of resistance tactics).
- resisting can take many forms
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:52 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
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Buttman 007
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Tezza
I was under the impression that average Germans were just trying to survive under an excessively oppressive and tyrannical regime during the 1930's. Everything that I've read suggests average Germans were frightened and ashamed by the extreme atrocities that happened under Hitler. I don't suppose you understand the horror of living under a dictatorship, do you?
In the modern world, what about extremist Muslims? Do you think their actions make moderate Muslims "pathetic" like the average Germans of the 1930's?
Are all Afghans "pathetic" because of the tyranny of the Taliban?
Are the average citizens of (former) Yugoslavia, Sudan or Rwanda "pathetic" because of the genocide that occurred in their respective countries?
Or what about average Christians during the Inquisition? Pathetic too, I suppose.
I find it somewhat strange that you would take the abhorrent actions of the Nazi Party and smear the morality of all Germans who lived during that time. That seems very racist and narrow-minded, which I never gathered from you in the past.
The only other explanation is that you completely misread "The Banality of Evil," by Hannah Arendt. The action of one group is not a moral yardstick for all, and I don't believe average Germans of the 1930's believed any differently, despite Eichmann's defense.
Since I don't know you, I suppose it is possible that you suffer from fits of insanity. If so, I would recommend that you swallow a neuroleptic 1 hour before you respond so that this discussion can proceed with some degree of alacrity.
Buttman
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:48 pm on Feb. 8, 2009
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MickTheKick
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Quote: from tezza on 9:04 am on Feb. 9, 2009
Yes the Germans were a pathetic race back in the 1930's/40's. I find it rather amusing how any mention of atrocities by the Germans in WWII somehow gets relabelled as being done by the 'NAZI's' as if they were somehow different & unrelated to an average German. They were not
Tezza, your equation that all Germans of the 30/40ies were Nazis fails as much as the stupid excuse that only a few bad guys (Nazis) forced or seduced the poor Germans into Faschism... I do agree that the whole German society has failed before and during WWII and this as a leading cultural nation and in historic dimensions. But that doesn't make the first equation Germans=Nazis more true... If you don't understand the 'banality of evil' and the fact that the Nazis were no aliens but people like you and me, you don't understand much about Faschism at all. Believe me, I know what I'm talking about, I'm one of them... not the Nazis, the Germans... My generation (post WWII) has spent the second half of the last century trying to understand how this could have happened.
@Buttmann: Yes, many just tried to survive but that doesn't make a good excuse considering what has happened... Besides the fact that many, many others were totally enthusiastic about the Führer... In many countries btw...
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:40 am on Feb. 9, 2009
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ThaiPrivateEye II
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Not taking sides for or against any (respected) members here but I rather liked the Germans that I have met and worked extensively with.  Good beer as well...
TPE II
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:14 am on Feb. 9, 2009
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