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Chompoo
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seubeu, I'm not sure the verdict is in yet on Soi 33. Certainly for gogo bars and most bars outside of Soi 33 that is the understanding (BF, unless stated otherwise, implies sex). ŬI think in most cases the girls on Soi 33 don't just blindly accept BFs because the expectation of sex is so often there (rightly or wrongly). When offered a BF (not my experience, but from friends), they seem to usually ask something along the lines "What we go do?" and if the answer is good they accept the BF. Rarely is the answer "we go dance then we f_ck," so the girl usually has a reasonable out.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:09 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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haam sup
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seubeu,
Exactly my point, and I see that this is more about Soi 33, than about barfines in general, but the question was couched originally in a way that made it sound like there was an assumption that if you pay a barfine, you are entitled to sex. ŬI merely point out that that is a separate issue, which is often taken for granted, but is NOT a certainty.
Of course, a woman who abuses the point by not being clear about what she will do if her barfine is paid, and then refuses to go along, wouldn't last long in the business.
I personally would never even consider such a question, because I wouldn't go with anyone who didn't seem interested in the same thing I am interested in at the moment, i.e, sex, or attending a movie, or going to eat, etc. ŬThe idea of enforcing such an implicit agreement is repugnant to me. ŬI would rather take the hit in baht, than get involved in "I paid you, you MUST sleep with me" kinds of exchanges that I see referred to in many posts.
haam sup
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 8:14 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Hum
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Chompoo, I think it would be alright to negotiate with her in the bar if you really did like her and told her that and were respectful. Just make sure you are hitting it off with her and do it privately. It would then be up to her to give you an answer and if you were respectful she should also be back to you even if she turns you down.
But it is better to know then than waste a lot more time effort and money on someone who doesn't feel the same way too. I that case she just thinks of you as as a dead president and not someone who she is interested in.
Chances are you will know it was right from the beginning and will most likely get a positive response.
Hum
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:16 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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phiijames
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haam sup,
I think your outrage is misplaced. ŬMoney can't buy human beings but it can buy the services of human beings, and there's nothing morally wrong with that. ŬDo you never pay a hairdresser to cut your hair?
When a customer makes an agreement with an employer that a particular employee will perform a particular service for the customer, there is no implication that the employer or the customer can physically compel the employee to perform the service. An employee can always choose to withhold his labor. That's the difference between an employee and a slave. ŬNonetheless, if the employee doesn't perform the service as agreed, the employer will be in breach of his agreement with the customer and will be liable to compensate the customer for this. ŬAnd the employee may well be in breach of his employment contract with his employer.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 8:16 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Ballsburstin
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seubeu,
Agreed. A little of topic, but here is a FR supporting your supposition:
My TGF said that the police used to visit her bar every once and a while for beer, etc., and the owner would host them, no doubt to stay in their good graces. She even told me their bar was once visited by some hypocrite from the government, whom she had seen railing against the BKK nightlife -- naturally this Benedict Arnold left with one of the ladies. But back to the story: the policeman left with her. I don't think he paid the BF, think it was on the house. Anyway, he took her out to dinner, and one way or another ended up in his apartment or hotel (don't remember which). She didn't want to have sex with him, as she felt the whole thing with the cops was creepy anyway, so when the time came, she refused. He insisted, but didn't use force, though I think she said he tugged at her jeans a few times to try and get them off while she was sitting on the bed, but got nowhere. So he gave her cab fare to go back to the bar (she lived upstairs at the time). I think if he had persisted, there wasn't much she could have done.
She was lying on the bed in her apartment when she was telling me this story and then gave me this sly smile while saying: "If I stay like this [legs together], cannot take off [jeans]." That was her secret weapon. She has nicely rounded thighs and a tiny waist, and unless she helps, it is nearly impossible to get those (damn) jeans off, as they don't want to slide past her hips, even with the zipper wide open. I've watched her put them on, and it is a time consuming process 
So I guess my point is, that the girls do exercise free will regardless of the situation in which they have been barfined. In her case, the bar owner had no problem with her actions.
- Balls
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:19 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Chompoo
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Hum, I'm not comfortable explicitly negotiating for services with a "good" girl and find it breaks the illusion. I wouldn't have the same standard though if I walked into a BJ bar.
Also, my "dating" skills are not finely tuned for Thailand, so my readings on what the girls truly like is not very good. They "all" seem like they really, really like me.
It's all good advice, though, and something I can aim for.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:24 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Hum
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PhiiJames, excellent post. People often do things they don't particularly want to do for a paycheck. When I was a kid I mowed lawns not because I like to but because I wanted the money. The only difference here is our attitude about the sale of sex as a service. I myself know that many of the bargirls much prefer that work to other lower paying but not quite so frowned upon occupations.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:27 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Hum
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Chompoo you don't even nee to be that explicit about the sex. A question or two pointed to her about what will occur and comments like do I need to talk to the hotel about adding a guest for the night etc. should suffice to bring the conversation around while she can still maintain the good girl facade. Believe me I am never an asshole with my thai hosts and hostesses. It is their country and I respect that but leading the conversation to where you have a good feeling for what will happen later on will be beneficial to her as well.
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:32 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Chompoo
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Exactly my point, and I see that this is more about Soi 33, than about barfines in general, but the question was couched originally in a way that made it sound like there was an assumption that if you pay a barfine, you are entitled to sex. ŬI merely point out that that is a separate issue, which is often taken for granted, but is NOT a certainty.
Of course, a woman who abuses the point by not being clear about what she will do if her barfine is paid, and then refuses to go along, wouldn't last long in the business.
I personally would never even consider such a question, because I wouldn't go with anyone who didn't seem interested in the same thing I am interested in at the moment, i.e, sex, or attending a movie, or going to eat, etc. ŬThe idea of enforcing such an implicit agreement is repugnant to me. ŬI would rather take the hit in baht, than get involved in "I paid you, you MUST sleep with me" kinds of exchanges that I see referred to in many posts.
More hypocrisy and a little backtracking off a completely untenable position.
The assumption at a gogo bar is that if you pay the BF and the girl leaves with you that that means sex. If the girl is not planning on having sex she needs to make this clear before the BF is paid; that is the meaning of "implicit contract" in this case. Everybody knows this, which is why the system works. Girls who repeatedly break this implicit contract are out on the street and bar owners who tolerate it go out of business. If you have information on gogos where this is not the general rule, please let us know.
Where has anyone said "I paid you, you MUST sleep with me?" Do you like building up bogeymen to argue with so you can seem like a good guy? Is that your secret to having all the bargirls fall in love with you, as they apparently do (since you are apparently against prostitution).
Expecting a contract for sex to be upheld (whether it is implicit or explicit) is a far cry from rape. No one has stated that rape is an option, but pretty much everyone would agree that a guy is entitled to his BF back if the gogo girl was deliberately deceitful (and never planning on giving it up).
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 8:34 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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Yurune
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I enjoy the soi 33 bars...though would have to be in for a real treat to contemplate paying up to 1500B in bar fine alone. I've heard of many guys paying and saying how sweet she was and she wanted to develop some sort of relationship before having sex.
Not on my wallet.
Some of the girls down there are gorgeous.....and certainly behave and speak well......but I certainly think it's just another conjob to get paid a lot for not working.
Someone did once put forward the theory that the barfines are higher because there maybe no sex hence the girl had to make some money from the deal.....personally no guarantee of sex....should be free delivery...but thats just my mood today.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 8:36 pm on Jan. 13, 2003
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