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haam sup
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I think this deserves a relevant, if not definitive answer.
The difference between Eden and a brothel, as Old Hand described the ones in Yaowarat and in the number hotels, is the voluntary nature of places like Eden and the various MPs.
The girls at Eden and most big MPs work there, and have the freedom (and experience!) to quit and go somewhere else. They are at the high end of the business, and service the more visible (mostly farang) clientele.
Contrast this with a low-class Thai brothel, and you'll find the girls are often indebted and/or indentured to the MP/brothel owner. Sometimes this is the result of a 'business' arrangement between the girl and the owner, i.e., a loan. Other times the girl is without ANY choice in the matter: drug/alcohol/gambling addicted parents make deals with agents, often women from the local village, who work for the owners in the cities. They literally sell their daughters into bondage for an advance payment that may take YEARS to pay off.
As Old Hand pointed out, there is usually little or no medical supervision, and HIV is common, with the more run-of-the-mill STDs epidemic - chlamydia, etc.
This is the world most farangs never see, and is pretty shady, to say the least. It accounts for a HUGE majority of the pay-for-play in Thailand, and caters to laborers, enlisted military, etc., who pay a pittance. It has existed forever, and is quite discreet, Thai-style: no neon, no signage, no publicity. Could be a group of rooms above a shophouse in Chinatown, a drive-in curtained 'number hotel', or a 'lady-house' in a residential neighborhood.
No use moralizing about it: your opinion doesn't count. If you enter this world, you will just be yet another faceless, grunting consumer of (mostly poor) services. You, as a Westerner, will be a novelty, and will almost certainly treat the girl better than her Thai customers do. If you are the sadistic type, (I personally hope you rot in hell), you will be fairly safe, because these girls have no earthly person to give a shit. If you damage the goods, the owner may extract some compensation, up to and including an ass-kicking, if you can't pay for the damages, measured in loss of earnings by the girl.
Still feel good about it? These days, finding one that won't set you up with an underage girl, and then call the police to help extract a LOT of baht, will be an interesting search.
As if all the WILLING freelancers, and BGs and MP girls aren't enough...
So what is it?
Price? - stay home, and save the airfare.
Forbidden fruit? - pay the price, do the time.
Power tripping? - rot in hell.
Adventure? - takes tons of courage to take advantage of someone without a choice.
If this is your reason for going, Thailand doesn't need you.
haam sup
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:21 pm on May 18, 2003
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Lofty
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Yeh totally agree also HS. The thing is about respect yes we all dabble in the P4P but to me it should be as pleasurable as it can be for both parties.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 6:25 am on May 19, 2003
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Beer Barone
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It is definately a brothel....all you do at Eden Club is pay for sex.
brothel (noun) -
1. a building where prostitutes are available
sorry to use the p word, but it was the dictionary's answer to a very simple question. I'm not judging, I'm just making an observation.
BB
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 7:48 am on May 19, 2003
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haam sup
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Quote: from Beer Barone on 7:48 pm on May 19, 2003
It is definately a brothel....all you do at Eden Club is pay for sex.
brothel (noun) -
1. a building where prostitutes are available
sorry to use the p word, but it was the dictionary's answer to a very simple question. I'm not judging, I'm just making an observation.
BB
Not to put too fine a point on it, but I don't think we're addressing the same question.
Eden is CERTAINLY a brothel by most dictionary definitions, as is mostly EVERY massage parlor, etc.
But the Thai brothel has a definite quality (or lack of quality) that separates it from other venues where sex can be purchased in the country, and the ORIGINAL poster was addressing those places.
After posting my (sorry) long-winded answer, it dawned on me that not ALL sleazy sex has to be as socially irresponsible as the Thai brothels...I should mention the low-end freelance scene.
The Lumpini Park area has street walking freelancers after dark, if you feel brave, and nearly every town has a park or square where freelancers ply their trade.
Cheap sex in a 150 baht upcountry hotel may be just what you're missing 
Even Koh Samui has a scary, but available, low-end scene for truck drivers and the like. They will think they hit the mother lode if a farang turns up with 500 (or 300, or 200) baht...
haam sup
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 3:26 pm on May 19, 2003
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nokna
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brothel (noun) -
1. a building where prostitutes are available
so by definition Edens is a brothel,yes?
a Go-Go is a brothel?
what happens if you take them out?,does the definition change?.
my thoughts of a brothel have always been that you have to do the business on the premises.
so if you take a girl to your room,is the place they work a brothel?.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:13 pm on May 19, 2003
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Fritz
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@hs:
What a brilliant statement about the Thai brothels... Not at all long-winded!
Cheers,
Fritz
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:18 pm on May 19, 2003
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Sauron
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Other on this forum have said the same about Thai brothels (for Thais, and in the south for Malaysians) including myself. This is not to take away from haam sup's admirable statement.
Those places engage in indentured servitude, if not totally involuntary slave labor (kidnapped or fraudulently recruited, often transnational or refugee), and should be eradicated.
Anyone who thinks that such places have ANYTHING in common with establishments that cater to farang, and which employ totally voluntary staff, has their head up their ass.
"Dictionary definitions" would also cover every gogo bar and most pubs. Whether a gogo bar is a "brothel" is not especially relevant. The distinction between a maison d'assignation and a brothel is a fine one, and anyway some gogo bar have facilities for on-premises sex. Some short time hotels have girls available. So what?
In Thailand we use "brothel" in the very narrow way decribed above to mean a low class Thai crib whorehouse with indentured, or captive, girls. Westerners are NEVER welcome. The Thai word is "sawng".
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:43 pm on May 19, 2003
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Beer Barone
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Quote: from haam sup on 9:26 pm on May 19, 2003
Quote: from Beer Barone on 7:48 pm on May 19, 2003
It is definately a brothel....all you do at Eden Club is pay for sex.
brothel (noun) -
1. a building where prostitutes are available
sorry to use the p word, but it was the dictionary's answer to a very simple question. I'm not judging, I'm just making an observation.
BB
Not to put too fine a point on it, but I don't think we're addressing the same question.
Eden is CERTAINLY a brothel by most dictionary definitions, as is mostly EVERY massage parlor, etc.
But the Thai brothel has a definite quality (or lack of quality) that separates it from other venues where sex can be purchased in the country, and the ORIGINAL poster was addressing those places.
After posting my (sorry) long-winded answer, it dawned on me that not ALL sleazy sex has to be as socially irresponsible as the Thai brothels...I should mention the low-end freelance scene.
The Lumpini Park area has street walking freelancers after dark, if you feel brave, and nearly every town has a park or square where freelancers ply their trade.
Cheap sex in a 150 baht upcountry hotel may be just what you're missing
Even Koh Samui has a scary, but available, low-end scene for truck drivers and the like. They will think they hit the mother lode if a farang turns up with 500 (or 300, or 200) baht...
haam sup
I see what you are saying. I agree, so long as we both agree that Nokna is well....let's call him special.
BB
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:35 pm on May 19, 2003
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nokna
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i'm getting old and the brain cells are disappearing and not sure how to take the comment by BB.
i think i understand what he means,but by not 100% sure.
but there is another angle to this question.
in fact 2,which could change the meaning of a definition of a brothel.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:38 pm on May 19, 2003
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