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Mr Alan
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A tee-shirt with the image of Donald Duck on it that is made without permission of Disney Company may in fact have been made via some means to mechanical, electronic, or photographic method to copy the Disney copyrighted image. In that sense, even though it may not be an exact copy, it is a lot easier to copy Donald Duck’s image on a tee shirt than it is to make a fake Rolex watch (at least one that could pass for a real Rolex even at a distance).
The other point is that a officially licensed tee shirt with the image of Donald Duck is usually of no better quality than one produced without Disney authorization. The only thing that makes it a copyright violation is that Disney is not receiving any royalties on it. On the other hand, a fake Rolex, or fake Gucci handbag is of lesser quality and cost less to make than the original. In other words, it is not the tee shirt or the toy that is copyrighted, it is the Disney image on the tee shirt or toy that is copyrighted.
The reason why Rolex and Gucci try to enforce trademark laws is that the fake items are almost always of lesser quality than the real goods, and the fake items damage the brand name of the original. The reason why Disney enforces copyright protection against unlicensed toys and tee shirts with Disney characters on them is not because it damages the reputation of Disney, it is because they are greedy and want to be paid for the right to reproduce the original Disney image, even if the unlicensed image is exactly reproduced on a higher quality product.
Also, there are different copyright laws in the US that cover different kinds articles, such as those covered by the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DCMA) of 1998. These copyright laws are specifically for things like CD's, DVD's, software, which are probably the main copyright concern in people in this forum. The European Union passed the EU Copyright Directive or EUCD, similar in many ways to the DMCA.
Lastly, there are differences between copyrights and trademarks. Copyrights eventually expire, but trademarks never expire if they are renewed.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:40 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from IBFarang on 9:33 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
Exact copy or not for some reason the US has decided to hold copyrights to a higher standard than trademarks.
It is not really practical to have two different copyright laws, one for exact copies of Disney tee shirts and one for copies that are made by incompetent people who are too stupid to make an exact copy (or at least very close to an exact copy). With the advent of personal computers and computer aided manufacturing, I emphasize the word stupid.
But in fact, as I pointed out in my post above, the US and the EU have passed new copyright laws that specifically cover digital media that can be exactly copied. The Digital Millennium Copyright Act was only passed in response to the recent technological advances that make it easier to make an exact copy of copyrighted materials.
From a practical level, I don't think that US Customs really wants to have to distinguish between a DVD (Digital Video Disk) that is actually an analog copy made with a video camera, versus a true digital disk copy. If they find a bogus DVD, they are going to confiscate it in either case.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 9:57 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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Mr Alan
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Quote: from IBFarang on 9:33 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
Exact copy or not for some reason the US has decided to hold copyrights to a higher standard than trademarks.
The US and the EU have very similar laws, and they both have stricter enforcement of copyrights in the sense that there is no exclusion for a single item being imported without a valid copyright (unlike the exemption granted for a single item without a valid trademark). The implication that this is a US only practice is completely wrong. These laws have been negotiated by World Trade Organizations and various treaties among all the developed countries.
Iran is one of the few countries of the world where the official policy of the government is to not honor copyright protection laws from other nations (especially Western nations). Obviously, many other countries use selective enforcement, but their official policy is to not allow it.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 10:07 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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IBFarang
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I humbly disagree – rarely I have come across a pirated Disney related T-shirt (or any clothing item for that mater) that measured up to the same quality as the same type of item I find in the Disney stores. Most pirated items like these and including DVD’s and the such are of inferior quality when compared to legitimate items. Rarely have I seen a pirated DVD that was of the same quality of legitimate articles.
I would agree that money is the main motivator for Disney wanting to enforce it’s copyright (also the main motivator for Rolex/trademark) – but I do not agree that pirated products do not diminish Disney. I have seen plenty of pirated Disney related products that would never be approved by Disney – poor quality, poor use of the characters, not befitting the company image, etc.
Additionally the logic behind your argument (that pirated copyright goods do not diminish the company; while pirated trademarked goods do diminish the brand name) should lead one to believe that trademarks should be enforced more strictly that copyrights – which is the exact opposite of what Uncle Sam/EU/who ever have decided. For some reason the power that be have decided to allow pirated goods that do diminish the brand name, but wants to put the kibbutz on pirated goods that do not diminish the brand name?
One thing that all can agree on is that no matter if the pirated good violates a copyright or a trademark there is a financial concern for the legitimate company.
Edit in: I could care less if the country of discussion is US, EU, or Madagascar for that matter.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 10:24 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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IBFarang
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 11:51 am on Sep. 5, 2007
It is not really practical to have two different copyright laws, one for exact copies of Disney tee shirts and one for copies that are made by incompetent people who are too stupid to make an exact copy (or at least very close to an exact copy). With the advent of personal computers and computer aided manufacturing, I emphasize the word stupid.....
....From a practical level, I don't think that US Customs really wants to have to distinguish between a DVD (Digital Video Disk) that is actually an analog copy made with a video camera, versus a true digital disk copy. If they find a bogus DVD, they are going to confiscate it in either case.
While it may be difficult to make an exact copy of a Rolex, I would venture to say that it would not be so difficult to make exact copies of Gucci purses, Armani Ties, Calvin Klein underwear, or a North Face jackets. Especially as you say in the world of today there is so much technology that is available. Yet they are afforded less protection than a Daffy T-shirt? Are Ducks really that precious?
One used to be able to buy North Face jackets in Korea that were made on the exact same assembly line as the legitimate ones – they fell off the truck don’t you know. At prices significantly lower than the “legitimate” ones.
The question still begs to be asked – why allow the exemption of one trademark related item, but not one copyright related item? If it is practical to make sure no one brings in even one pirated DVD, why is it not practical to try and make sure no one brings in even one pirated Gucci purse?
No worries - since pirated DVD’s are so easy to make “exact” copies it should be near impossible for customs agents to distinguish between them and the real deal anyway – right?
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 10:44 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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Mel Gibson
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Mr Alan,, although I agree with a lot of what you say I have to point out that some fakes are in fact much BETTER quality than the originals.
A classic example is the "Armani" jeans,, I purchased a pair of the real thing in Australia,, nice cut for my shape and a nice pair of jeans,, material was somewhat light in duty.
A year later whilst walking in Chatachack market I saw Armani jeans for sale,, obviously fakes as they were only 270 BAHT a pair, I got 5 pairs, the quality of workmanship was superior to the originals, the material was heavier and better, with exactly the same cut and they have outlasted the originals by 4 years already.I am so impressed by the quality I will never buy originals again 
Mel.
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:44 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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ThaidUp
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Yes the companies want to make sure we are buying their controlled products that contain lead. A name brand used to convey a higher standard of quality, but not no more, the budgets for proper manufacturing have been slashed and given to sports and celebs to sport their wares. It has be noted that the biggest consumer of fake goods have been the rich themselves as their wealth status does not put them in question as to if they are fake products or not, but it does make them appear to be smarter as in who wants to pay several thousand dollars for a handbag most likely made in a 3rd world country using slave labor.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 11:48 pm on Sep. 4, 2007
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jack attack
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Mr. Alan,
with so many valid points made in this debate, I wonder where the information for comments such as the following originate:
"The only thing that makes it a copyright violation is that Disney is not receiving any royalties on it."
I think this is inaccurate in the very least. One could interpret you are suggesting that there is an implicit or even explicit contract involved and Disney, by not being paid, should go after the culprits for breach of contract. Don't think so.
May I alter this discussion a bit?...
The Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) has irrefutable evidence that the people behind movie piracy, counterfeiting, bootlegging, et al, are the same involved in the illegal drug trade, child pornagraphy distribution as well as human trafficking. In other words, it is organized crime. And if you don't believe them, think for moment, how the f*ck can the copies of movies get all over the world within a few days of its release in the first cinema? Someone has a very well developed network in place and it must be the same one that can move any measure of illegal goods and services.
So you walk down the street in Beijing, Bangkok, Manila, Jakarta, Moscow, NYC, LA and you find a copy of a movie that is currently playing in the theater for sale for US$ 1-3. Obviously less money than buying a theater ticket in the US or buying the original DVD 3-4 months later.
The price of a movie ticket may be US$ 3-10 depending on which of these cities you happen to be in. The price of an original DVD 3-4 months later will be US$ 8- 25 again depending which city you are lurking. And the same DVD will be available for rent for US$.80 - 3.00.
In each case, the price of original and copy can be offset by renting or the timing of availability can be offset by going to the cinema.
Why support the bad guys?
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:16 am on Sep. 5, 2007
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Buai
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Quote: from Mel Gibson on 1:38 pm on Sep. 5, 2007
I am so impressed by the quality I will never buy originals again
Yes, but did they have a picture of Donald Duck on them?
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 1:21 am on Sep. 5, 2007
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Buai
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Quote: from jack attack on 3:10 pm on Sep. 5, 2007
In each case, the price of original and copy can be offset by renting or the timing of availability can be offset by going to the cinema.
Why support the bad guys?
Because they give me what I want, when I want and at the price I want?
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 1:23 am on Sep. 5, 2007
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