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Mr Alan
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Quote: from Broken Leg on 2:52 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
It would depend on your interpretation of attacked. On 9/11 approx 3000 people died, many more died in germany due due to the treaty of versaille as we've already discussed.
Anyway like I said it's governments, i'm not just refering to Bush or trying to differentiate between right and left. Blair and the labour government did exactly the same in the UK.
The point i'm trying to make is that there is a culture of fear. Governments can manipulate the citizens of their countries by spinning this fear so the reality of the situation is totally distorted. So now Daffy is scared of the Chinese.
Can anyone anywhere in the world show me any terroist link with saddams Iraq - no. So the US was not attacked by Iraq. But now however there are quite a few terroist links. My own personal feeling on the war aren't relavent to this thread, I'm not saying I'm for or against it. I'm just saying I don't think George really cared what the intelligence said and that I don't think his war on terror can be won.
If you feel differently obviously you are perfectly entitled too.
Millions died in Russia of famine when Stalin’s first 5 year plan failed after WWI. But Russia was not attacked and neither was Germany before WWII. The USA was attacked on 9/11. If you don't know the difference then I guess I can't explain it to you. Quoting Nazi propoganda on this subject does not throw light on this subject.
There is fear, but it is not a cultural issue. It based on some rather objective and sobering analysis of the world situation and the events that have already occurred. Both Bill Gates and Warren Buffet (both Democrats and the 2 richest men in the world) have said it is not a matter of "if" an atomic bomb is exploded by terrorists, but only "when." Similar warnings come from the Democrats in the US Congress almost every day as they criticize the homeland security efforts of the Bush Administration.
George Bush was a isolationist before 9/11 and he received a lot of criticism for that. After 9/11 he did a complete 180 degree turn. Whatever he does now is because he thinks it is necessary to defend the United States and civilization as we know it, and make the predictions of Bill Gates and Warren Buffet never come true. Whether Bush has made the correct decisions toward achieving that goal remains to be seen, but I have no respect for people who question his motives.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 4:39 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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Broken Leg
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Quote: from Mr Alan on 4:33 am on Feb. 27, 2005
Whatever he does now is because he thinks it is necessary to defend the United States and civilization as we know it,.
Yes I sure it is.
Quote: from manowar on 4:04 am on Feb. 27, 2005
well, the US GDP is 132 trillions
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Bangkok Women : Meet Sensual Bangkok Women
Posted on: 5:15 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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tourist
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I agree, BTF is not the forum for this crap so I will be brief.
The 100K analogy is gibberish. GDP is not analogous to income. Tax revenue is analogous to income. According to 2004 Financial Report of the United States Government the US National Debt is 7.7 Trillion, Tax Revenue is 1.9 Trillion and Annual Budget Deficit is 412 Billion (Note: Actual Shortfall for 2004 was 616 Billion).
The US Government is like an individual making $100K/yr, who owes a total of $405K and charges $22K more on his Visa each year.
"Deficits caused by tax cuts are not significant" Deficits caused by PERMANENT tax cuts are significant and are not an economic stimulus.
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Thai Girls : Meet Sexy Thai Girls
Posted on: 5:26 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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manowar
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Quote: from tourist on 1:20 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
I agree, BTF is not the forum for this crap so I will be brief.
The 100K analogy is gibberish. GDP is not analogous to income. Tax revenue is analogous to income. According to 2004 Financial Report of the United States Government the US National Debt is 7.7 Trillion, Tax Revenue is 1.9 Trillion and Annual Budget Deficit is 412 Billion (Note: Actual Shortfall for 2004 was 616 Billion).
The US Government is like an individual making $100K/yr, who owes a total of $405K and charges $22K more on his Visa each year.
"Deficits caused by tax cuts are not significant" Deficits caused by PERMANENT tax cuts are significant and are not an economic stimulus.
you are absolutely right about the US Government living beyond its means. But what we are discussing here is not whether the US government is living beyond its means, but rather the effect of the US budget deficit (600 billions) has on its national debts ( 7 trillions ) and on the US economy ( 132 trillions). This is without taking into the consideration of the US net assets values which has to be in the gazillions !! ( Does anyone know what the US net assets values is ? ) So a person (US economy, not US government) who makes 100k ( 132 trillions) runs up a personal debts of $5k ( 7 trillions) who adds $480/year ( 600 billions ) to his personal debts, but has many many millions of personal assets (? gazillions US assets). I don't see a big problem here.
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Sexy Bangkok Girls
Posted on: 6:12 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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Broken Leg
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Oi Manowar,
where did you get your GDP data from?
Can't find the exact 2004 figures but here is the 2003 stuff from the world bank
US GDP 11 trillion, total debt 7 trillion, so by your formula
11/7 *100 = 64%
Ouch
http://www.worldbank.org/data/databytopic/GDP.pdf
can we finish this now please.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 6:33 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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DaffyDuck
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Unfortunately, it's not that easy - especially if the many, many millions of personal assets are all either spoken for (i.e. mortgaged) or are rapidly eroding in value... The US is currently doing nothing to add value to their assets, but instead bending over backwards to add value to the assets of those they borrow from - can you do the math?
Broken Leg, if I have mistakenly given you the impression that I am 'afraid' of the Chinese, that's incorrect - I think what the Chinese are doing is rather ingenious, it's just unfortunate that the US is sliding headlong into this situation, seemingly oblivious, and feeling that they can recover.
Dr. von Quack!
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Bangkok Women : Meet Beautiful Thai Girls
Posted on: 6:55 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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DaffyDuck
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Quote: from Broken Leg on 2:24 am on Feb. 27, 2005
As for innovation and the only the US being able to produce a company like apple, jesus man are you the most arrogant, ignorant duck in the world. Do you think an American invented capitalism?
There was a time when Chinese technology was far ahead of anything in the world, they invented paper, the first plastic, gunpowder, the first printing, the wheelbarrow (which at that time revolutionised agricultural production), the water clock, to name just a few. The chinese (literally) taught the rest of the world how to wipe it's arse. Chinese science and technology regressed for cultural reasons. Anyway, you ever seen a skyline like Shanghai in the US. If you would like to study this I would strongly recommend a book called the wealth and poverty of Nations by David Landes an excellent read. How bout you daffy I guess you’re pretty innovative you managed to turn a dog into a duck.
Okay, then let me correct that my statement refers to 'this particular time in the world' - obviously the Chinese at one point led the world in terms of innovation, discovery, science and invention -- that's nice, but the same can be said for the Arabs (Moors), the Egyptians, etc.... yet at this particular time in history, the prior two are merely a footnote in history (even though much of what they contributd lives on).
Similarly, despite the historical contributions by the Chinese a *LONG TIME AGO*, the majority of innovations and contributions since the industrial revolution had not come from them (or the Arabs, or the Egyptians...) - at this particular time in history, the kind of innovation and inventiveness that makes the world 'go around' does come from America for the most part - and while much of that is shifting (especially in science and medical research, thanks to the religious conservatives), the innovations in consumer products and consumer technologies are still 'invented here' (though clearly most if not all manufactured in China).
This can, and will, change and shift eventually - but in the case of China it will require a significant cultural and ideological shift - a government and culture de-stressing individualism in favor of conformity, does not help the growth of individual and innovative spirits - As I said, this can, and will invariably change, but not right now, and not for the near future.
Dr. von Quack!
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Bangkok Girls : Meet Attractive Thai Girls
Posted on: 7:10 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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thailife
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Lesson #1: When rates are low borrow ALL you can. Over time if you borrow money at 3% and pay it off over many years, this works. Why? Becuase as sure as I write this, inflation comes back into play, and all that money that is borrowed at 3% is paid back in dollars that are worth half. So in the end, you borrow one $, you pay it back in inflated $'s, and the REAL value of the money after you pay it all back (when you consider inlfation) is 50 cents.
Lesson #2: The U.S. govt. has fooled EVERY central bank in the world into supporting our debt by issueing them bonds at 3%, only to pay them back in dollar amounts that in real terms is a NEGATIVE rate of return for all the lenders (central banks)
so the laugh is really on all the central banks that financed this debt at historic (40 year low interest rates)....
Lesson #3: the U.S. economy is THE driver for export based economy's world wide. The U.S. catches a cold, the export driven econmy's of the word catch a death rattleing flu. In other words, the U.S. is the dog that wags the tail.
Lesson #4: U.S. assets held offshore stay there because of the tax consequenses of bringing them back to the U.S. U.S. foreign investment is much greater then statistics show, this is because of the multi year build up of these assets, not to mention the tax games these corporations play to dummy down the numbers.
Lesson #5: The CHinese econmy is a mess. Their If their banking system ran by U.S. rules, most of the banks there would be deemed 'insolvent'.
Lesson #6: The european Union is a joke as an economy. Double digit unemployment, socialist policies, etc. will doom this entity. The Euro monatary game is just that, a game. The English were smart not to take part in that fiasco and thier economic growth (by all studies that have been conduct, i.s., research recent articles in Business Week and Forbes) has been directly related to them NOt becoming involed in the EU.
Lesson #7: I don't give a s hit about this subject because I have p ussy on my mind
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Thai Girls : Meet Active Thai Girls
Posted on: 9:08 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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tourist
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Manowar, in 2004 the US Government paid $322 Billion in interest on the Nation Debt. That's most of the Annual Budget Deficit and almost 20% of all the revenues the US Government collects (80% of which are from individual income tax). Broken Leg is correct. 2004 GDP was $11.7 Trillion according to US Bureau of Economic Analysis The National Debt is 66% of GDP. This is problem. This is the highest it has ever been, excluding WW II, and it is much higher than it was in WW I, the Great Depression or the Civil War. Your analogy comparing GDP & National Debt to Individual Income & Individual Debt makes absolutely no sense.
thailife, unfortunately for me, my new boss canceled my trip to Bangkok this month. If I was there I wouldn't waste time on this crap either.
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Thai Women : Meet Matured Thai Women
Posted on: 9:56 pm on Feb. 26, 2005
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